In response to Jaredoggy
If you waste 15-30 seconds a day looking at adds, in your entire life time you'll spend anywhere from 4.5 to 9 days looking at ads, without a single break.

And that's if you watch a single ad. If you relog once, or even twice you could easily spend an entire month of your life looking at ads.
Or a simple $10 for 90 days without ads.
FIREking wrote:
The ads are here to stay, and if they don't earn enough revenue, BYOND is being shut down indefinitely.

If BYOND shuts down, would it be impossible to still develop?

I'd imagine people could integrate their own user account system and such, right? Or would it hinder the servers to where it would be impossible to use? A bit of PHP, SQL and a website would keep things running?

Obviously, BYOND shutting down is bad and BYOND itself is a form of advertisement as it is a community. So we'd be missing a lot. Just curious, I'd hate to see all of everyone's projects go to waste.
In response to Lavitiz
You could still play single player games. You could play multiplayer games but every key would be a guest key.
You would still be able to make/host/play games.
Keep in mind that even if we shut down, keys will continue to work (there is local authentication and hub authentication, but the hub is bypassed when it is unreachable). Users won't be able to create new keys and existing games would want to move to a guest-based system. So rest assured that the demise of BYOND will not ruin its existing games.
In response to Tom
Tom wrote:
Keep in mind that even if we shut down, keys will continue to work (there is local authentication and hub authentication, but the hub is bypassed when it is unreachable). Users won't be able to create new keys and existing games would want to move to a guest-based system. So rest assured that the demise of BYOND will not ruin its existing games.

I'd assume you'd release an update with the ad system removed if BYOND did shut down, right?

Bottom line, we need to pay Tom and Lummox. BYOND Forever.
In response to Tom
Technically speaking, it would also still be possible to develop with BYOND right? I mean the hubs would be gone, and I suspect the pager would lose most of its functions, but the development tools and such would still be available as is correct?

Also, if in the event such a horrible thing happened, would the standalone client be available to all users? or at least to people who pay a small fee for permission?


@Lavitz: I second this. It makes me feel really uneasy thinking about BYOND going down. Silly, perhaps, but it's just where I find game design to be the most comfortable and fun. Sure, I can learn a bit, and go elsewhere, but then there is WAY too much stuff I have to program and do that BYOND normally handles for us.

I'd probably have to go down to one area of skill, too, because being a solo developer for 2D games without BYOND seems a lot crazier than it does on BYOND, where it's already tough enough.

Hopefully a lot of people feel similar, games will keep popping up, and something will nail things down well enough to get things stable; whether one or multiple projects and/or developers it just needs to happen.
In response to Toddab503
Toddab503 wrote:
Technically speaking, it would also still be possible to develop with BYOND right? I mean the hubs would be gone, and I suspect the pager would lose most of its functions, but the development tools and such would still be available as is correct?


The pager would lose all of its functionality. Development tools would still exist and work, but things like CheckPassport(), IsByondMember(), GetScores(), SetScores(), GetMedal(), and SetMedal() would all become non-functional.

What Nadrew said.

If we halted the project, we'd just open source it so people could do what they wanted. It would work fine but it would probably be harder to get initial players.
I think I'm actually the only one who enjoy the ads...
You probably are.

Personally, I keep them on here solely to support BYOND, because I hate ads too.
What is worth more per year, ad revenue from a single user, or a 1 year BYOND membership?

Assuming every ad was clicked once.
Stop calling people kids. Seriously, it makes you look immature. There is no need for insults of any kind in this topic.

People do not seem to understand my post. I said i am fine with this ads, i just disapprove of the way they are being delivered. Is it not possible to have the ads play somewhere else, say in the client itself, without interrupting server joining at all? I feel like if it were possible, then people would be far more accepting.

For the record, some games restart the server after a round ends. SS13 for example...

Rounds on SS13 can be anything from 5 minutes to 3 hours long. After a round ends, the server restarts requiring you to rejoin. As anyone can imagine, having to suffer through those ads many times a day can be rather irritating.
In response to Dazbuzz
Dazbuzz wrote:
For the record, some games restart the server after a round ends. SS13 for example...

Rounds on SS13 can be anything from 5 minutes to 3 hours long. After a round ends, the server restarts requiring you to rejoin. As anyone can imagine, having to suffer through those ads many times a day can be rather irritating.

5 minutes to 3 hours of gameplay, and you're bitching about a few Ads?
When those ads are delaying my joining of a round, then yes.
In response to Dazbuzz
So buy a membership, and turn the ads off? Then you can be content in knowing you've both removed the ads on ALL of BYOND for yourself, and helped support the thing that not only helped make the game(s) you enjoy, but also continues to allow you to easily access several servers, a forum, and such for it every day.

I know some people, whether kids or not, do not have the money, but BYOND is working on adding in some ways for developers to pay to remove ads for all the players of their games, so I really don't see the problem. It doesn't matter if the developers, or the players pay, BYOND just needs some kind of income in order to keep maintaining the services that far too many people take for granted on a daily basis. I don't mean to target anyone specific with that comment, I just mean in general.

I'm sure games like SS13 will work out something to remove their ads from a server, or the game, so there shouldn't be a problem for round based games users, either.

I also do not understand anyone in general complaining about ads on BYOND or encouraging them to change with how ridiculous youtube is with ads, or even Pandora, which is something that is just as bad as or worse than any round based game on BYOND about ads, and yet it likely has far more users than BYOND has.

BYOND is literally doing similar to Pandora, and with Pandora having so many more users, I just don't get peoples issue. Buy a membership, encourage the developers of the game to pay to turn off ads, or endure them; that's the entirely fair options everyone has in my opinion. Which is one more option than Pandora has, I think. It all seems more than fair if it keeps BYOND running okay, if you ask me.

Note: Sorry if this post is a bit out of sorts, or tough to read. I had it all set up much nicer, and more politely but then I got an error that prevented my post from going through, and forgot to copy before posting; so I was pretty annoyed while rewriting this.

I'm not trying to target, insult, or be mean to anyone; just stating my point of view.


TL;DR

While it is somewhat debatable, Youtube handle ads in a way that is just as bad, if not worse than BYOND. Pandora, something that likely has far more users than BYOND, uses almost the same ad method as BYOND, but without the option for someone else to pay for many users to no longer have ads.

Everyone just buy a membership, encourage the developers of the game(s) you play to pay to remove ads, or endure the ads. Ads suck, and even the owners/developers of BYOND hate them, but they have to stay in exactly the way they are if there is gonna be any hope for BYOND to stick around and keep giving you easy access and such to your game(s)
In response to Toddab503
Toddab503 wrote:
So buy a membership, and turn the ads off? Then you can be content in knowing you've both removed the ads on ALL of BYOND for yourself, and helped support the thing that not only helped make the game(s) you enjoy, but also continues to allow you to easily access several servers, a forum, and such for it every day.

I know some people, whether kids or not, do not have the money, but BYOND is working on adding in some ways for developers to pay to remove ads for all the players of their games, so I really don't see the problem. It doesn't matter if the developers, or the players pay, BYOND just needs some kind of income in order to keep maintaining the services that far too many people take for granted on a daily basis. I don't mean to target anyone specific with that comment, I just mean in general.

I'm sure games like SS13 will work out something to remove their ads from a server, or the game, so there shouldn't be a problem for round based games users, either.

I also do not understand anyone in general complaining about ads on BYOND or encouraging them to change with how ridiculous youtube is with ads, or even Pandora, which is something that is just as bad as or worse than any round based game on BYOND about ads, and yet it likely has far more users than BYOND has.

BYOND is literally doing similar to Pandora, and with Pandora having so many more users, I just don't get peoples issue. Buy a membership, encourage the developers of the game to pay to turn off ads, or endure them; that's the entirely fair options everyone has in my opinion. Which is one more option than Pandora has, I think. It all seems more than fair if it keeps BYOND running okay, if you ask me.

Note: Sorry if this post is a bit out of sorts, or tough to read. I had it all set up much nicer, and more politely but then I got an error that prevented my post from going through, and forgot to copy before posting; so I was pretty annoyed while rewriting this.

I'm not trying to target, insult, or be mean to anyone; just stating my point of view.


TL;DR

While it is somewhat debatable, Youtube handle ads in a way that is just as bad, if not worse than BYOND. Pandora, something that likely has far more users than BYOND, uses almost the same ad method as BYOND, but without the option for someone else to pay for many users to no longer have ads.

Everyone just buy a membership, encourage the developers of the game(s) you play to pay to remove ads, or endure the ads. Ads suck, and even the owners/developers of BYOND hate them, but they have to stay in exactly the way they are if there is gonna be any hope for BYOND to stick around and keep giving you easy access and such to your game(s)

My previous post may have looked a little childish and ad-hominem, but I would like to say this.

You can't avoid the fact that, even with what you said, developers being able to pay so there are no more ads for their games, you never know if they will or not.

I don't think that the implemention of ads is the problem, but the way they're being delivered is the problem. Audio ads where you can't turn the audio off, for example, are very annoying and like I said before, I was forced to hear sounds I didn't even want to hear in my previous post.

One more thing is that you can't minimize the loading windows either. So if you want to do something in the background while there's an ad, you can't. You're forced to stare at the ad.

This new BYOND look itself is problematic, to be honest, but that's besides the point. The ads shouldn't be removed, but the way they're being delivered should.

I hope at least some people agree with this.
In response to SuperToby12
Unfortunately, when it comes to advertising, the more annoying and unavoidable it is, the more it pays. If you could mute, minimize, or otherwise ignore the ads, companies wouldn't bother paying for them. This is the same reason it isn't simply a static banner ad in the pager: it wouldn't generate nearly as much revenue.

I'm curious to see what the rates are for the new ad system Tom is working on (@Tom, is it for standalone games only, or will games on the hub also be eligible?). It might end up being reasonably affordable for players/developers to "buy out" the ads for their favorite games and keep them ad-free.
In response to DarkCampainger
DarkCampainger wrote:
Unfortunately, when it comes to advertising, the more annoying and unavoidable it is, the more it pays. If you could mute, minimize, or otherwise ignore the ads, companies wouldn't bother paying for them. This is the same reason it isn't simply a static banner ad in the pager: it wouldn't generate nearly as much revenue.

I'm curious to see what the rates are for the new ad system Tom is working on (@Tom, is it for standalone games only, or will games on the hub also be eligible?). It might end up being reasonably affordable for players/developers to "buy out" the ads for their favorite games and keep them ad-free.

That doesn't make any sense at all. Ads are ads. No matter in what form, they do the same. You shouldn't force people to listen to things they don't want to listen. Ads should be interesting, and they are if done right. If done right people wouldn't mind seeing or listening to them, but when they hear sounds they don't want to hear or the ad is not enjoyable at all, it's a bad ad. If ads are gonna be implemented, they should be implemented the right way.
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