ID:277241
 
unfortunately i don't think byond works for windows vista yet due to it being brand new and all, but i have it and probably cant go back to windows XP for some time, so it would be cool if they would make a version for windows vista, whenever they get the chance to work on that one...etc
isn't vista in beta...?

why would they make a version of this for an operating system that isn't even released.
In response to Silent Sage (#1)
Wait...I thought it was out?
In response to Shlaklava (#2)
I don't keep up with it. I thought it was still in beta.
In response to Silent Sage (#3)
Silent Sage wrote:
I don't keep up with it. I thought it was still in beta.
Still is. Won't be available (broadly available, anyway) till about February (Jan 30, actually).
In response to Misproduction_Studios (#4)
The BYOND staff should play around with Vista Beta in my opinion. They should also start playing around with DX10, it's available to software developers. However, this doesn't mean they CAN. A vista system with a DX10 video card isn't as cheap as it sounds, especialy if you want it running efficiently.

So, in my opinion the BYOND staff should work on releaseing the final beta and then the full release, THEN begin playing around with Vista. By the time this version is finished i'm sure developer wise it will be easier to access. This way, we don't lose updates, and things will be more available to mess with.

Oh and if we do go to Vista... i'm hopeing for faster rendering with use of DX10. Not sure what BYOND uses now... seems like OpenGL? The way microsoft is working, video cards are going to start getting limited feature wise but it will be VASTLY increase compatability with itself across systems as well as preformance.

Another option that could very well launch BYOND into massive sized games is makeing it compatabile with PhysX chips. Those things are freaking insane...

But yeah, it would be nice to eventualy see a vista version, sooner rather then later but it's completely up to them. Kudos to the BYOND team for their work. ^_^
In response to Stevenw9 (#5)
BYOND currently uses BitBLT. Moving to DirectX would be about as close as you could come to a step backwards without actually stepping backwards. Hello, people who use linux would like a working GUI? And why the bloody hell would you switch from OpenGL to DX10? They do the same things, but OpenGL does it better.

The version they're currently working on uses OpenGL, IIRC. That will probably not speed up drawing significantly - it'll just let us play around with alpha channels and more colours in icons, pretty much. And screen-resizingness.

Vista support will likely turn up a little after 4.0, and not before.

Which means you'll be waiting a while. :P

EDIT: And I'm not sure how you think using DirectX will increase compatibility. And it won't make it much faster. The reason BYOND runs 'slowly' is because it's interpreted, and because there's no client-side processing model - the server does most of the calculation. That, and the 10 FPS limit.
In response to Jp (#6)
From what i've heard, OpenGL will run like the craziest psycho in the world on drugs, on Vista. I could be very wrong, but also Video Cards such as Nvidia are going to seriously lack on OpenGL support due to DX10.
In response to Stevenw9 (#7)
No, it's because Windows is trying to lock it down. And AFAIK, they've now backed away from the whole vendor-lockin-OpenGL thing. And there's no way video card manufacturers are going to stop supporting OpenGL.

And guess what? You have no idea what you're talking about.
In response to Jp (#8)
Yes actualy I do, and I never said STOP OpenGL support, they're going to lack it. Meaning sure, it will work, but not as efficiently as it's SUPPOSED to.
In response to Stevenw9 (#7)
Stevenw9 wrote:
From what i've heard, OpenGL will run like [profanity] on Vista. I could be very wrong,

Microsoft isn't making a generic openGL video card driver that will run Aero. It doesn't matter much, since ATI, Nvidia, etc, all do their own already anyways.

but also Video Cards such as Nvidia are going to seriously lack on OpenGL support due to DX10.

Sounds like bad news for all gamers who like Doom 3, any of ID Software's other titles, or the plethora of open-GL-using games out there. If true, NVidia would just be shooting themselves in the foot. And after NVidia hypothetically shot themselves in the foot, they would quickly release a new driver with proper OpenGL support.
In response to Stevenw9 (#9)
Clearly, you do not. They're going to support OpenGL fully. It would be stupid not to, because it is also a widely-used graphics library. Honestly, it's just a matter of writing a driver. You do understand that, right?
In response to Jon88 (#10)
I'm sure OpenGL will start getting attention awhile after Vista is released. The DX10 lockdown is also going to limit features on the Video Cards unless THEY update it to work properly. MicroSHAFT is being quite annoying lately. OpenGL is the only hope left... let's hope that doesn't go down the drain as well.
In response to Jp (#11)
Apparently you do not understand the complexity of DX10. It's nowhere near as simple as DX9, it's a full rework of its own core. Anyway, try googleing around. Nvidia is very wary on this situation and it's throwing alot of people into confusion.
In response to Stevenw9 (#13)
Wow! A full rework of its own core!

It still just requires changes to the driver. DirectX doesn't directly interface with the video card. It goes through the driver. Adding compatibility for DirectX on a card is as simple as rewriting the driver so that DirectX can interface with it properly.

And given that a rewrite of the core likely wouldn't change the interface much if they've been doing everything all modular and lovely, like they should, then a core rewrite isn't actually that big.

I suggest you figure out what you're talking about. I mean, DirectX for better compatibility? What were you thinking?
In response to Jp (#14)
Compatability across windows based computers, yes. Does that make me insane? Maybe, but it's been officialy stated as such. And as for writing a driver, it wont be as easy as it is now... drivers are about to get a kick to the balls.
In response to Stevenw9 (#15)
It's not even compatible across windows platforms. It's Windows Vista only. If you would be so kind, not forcing my Windows partition to be 'updated' to Windows Vista would be nice.

And given that there have been plans for a Linux graphical client for a while, DirectX would sort of not help compatibility there.

It only increases compatibility in a 1984-esque, War is Peace, Ignorance is Strength, Freedom is Slavery sense.

And you clearly have no idea what you're talking about. Writing a driver would be the same as ever. The requirements for a card to be considered DX 10 compatible are stricter, but guess what? That's nothing to do with drivers! They're all things a card can do and OpenGL can take advantage of as well! And they're things that are currently being done anyway!
In response to Jp (#16)
What I ment was, if you use a Mac with Vista, and you use a PC with Vista, both will be hella more compatibile with a game then normal. Understand that now?
In response to Stevenw9 (#17)
easy on the foul language, Steven, in particular you might want to edit your second post (reply to Jp) in this thread. the others would hurt with a look-see too.
In response to Stevenw9 (#17)
Errrr... what? That doesn't make any sense. There's no 'mac' version of Vista. There's x86 macs that you can install Vista on, but that's about it.

Switching to DX10 likely won't help Vista compatibility either. I'm unaware of precisely why BYOND doesn't work on Vista, and it could be some weirdness with Vista's implementation of BitBLT - if it implements it. But more likely, there are other system libraries that have been changed, too. Changing to DX10 wouldn't support that.

And why the hell would you use DX when there's OpenGL available? Why would Dantom even care about making BYOND 'compatible' with an OS that's currently in beta by throwing out every other OS on the planet?
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