Stray Games

by Falacy
Because BYOND.
ID:1854329
 
Quick notes after trying to use the web client for a few minutes, probably 1,000 more issues I didn't get around to:

  • client.view is ignored for world.view
  • over 9,000 layering issues
  • maptext issues, possibly specific to my outline system, didn't investigate
  • performance issues in Box Zombies, though HU ran fine
  • Rendering distance issues, causing buildings to disappear
  • graphical loading issues, causing the world to pop in as you walk around
  • You can't get parameters from multiple interface controls in a single winget(), broke my login and register systems
  • Need an option to disable the byond login popup, though this problem is likely specific to Box Zombies, so understandable its missing.
  • HU didn't seem to load interface macros/controls, making the game unplayable
  • HU had an issue with the right click menu, showing mob/Player/Add_Friend() on /turfs
  • Probably other stuff I forgot


On a vaguely positive note, the web client version of HU seemed to run a lot smoother than the seeker version, almost as smoothly as a local single player instance of the game, though that probably means something still needs improving/fixing in seeker's networking. And the web client has AA, which makes it look a bit better, though that's likely just because its running in a software mode equivalent (causes similar performance issues in Box Zombies).

While we're on the subject of just how amazing BYOND is, check out this recap of the most played "original" games currently on the main page
If you dislike it do something about it. Box Zombies a nice game and all but your Falacy you could make an RPG, PVP, or even a RP game that people would enjoy.
In response to Ganite
Ganite wrote:
If you dislike it do something about it. Box Zombies a nice game and all but your Falacy you could make an RPG, PVP, or even a RP game that people would enjoy.

Box Zombies is an RPG, it has PVP, and RP games aren't a thing. The only thing you need to RP in a game, is a chat system, which Box Zombies also has. And what would you like me to do about BYOND's staff being incompetent? I could certainly program a few things properly for them if they want to hire me at a ridiculous salary. BYOND should really just shut itself down and redirect to http://www.Unity3D.com (for the good of humanity).
Just logged on Box Zombies haven't tried it in a few years and I must say it is a lot better. Looks like you put a ton of work into it. But I love BYOND mainly because I'm a hobbyist, I'd be sad if BYOND went away. Its easier to understand then Java, Unity, and all the rest.
In response to Ganite
Ganite wrote:
Just logged on Box Zombies haven't tried it in a few years and I must say it is a lot better. Looks like you put a ton of work into it. But I love BYOND mainly because I'm a hobbyist, I'd be sad if BYOND went away. Its easier to understand then Java, Unity, and all the rest.

I don't really find Unity's JavaScript any harder to use than BYOND's DM, and the general interface is far more intuitive. Though, it is a bit more complicated to implement multiplayer in Unity, as it isn't as automatically handled. However, that gives you control over networking, allowing you to client side vast majority of processes (as it should be done), theoretically allowing for thousands of players on a single server without lag concerns, and 100% lag free gameplay experience for the things that matter most (like basic movement).
In response to Falacy
Falacy wrote:
I don't really find Unity's JavaScript any harder to use than BYOND's DM
That's because it's not.

Though, it is a bit more complicated to implement multiplayer in Unity as it isn't as automatically handled.
Not anymore.

However, that gives you control over networking, allowing you to client side vast majority of processes (as it should be done), theoretically allowing for thousands of players on a single server without lag concerns, and 100% lag free gameplay experience for the things that matter most (like basic movement).

http://i.imgur.com/qFaLGAI.png
In response to Xirre
Xirre wrote:
Though, it is a bit more complicated to implement multiplayer in Unity as it isn't as automatically handled.
Not anymore.
http://i.imgur.com/qFaLGAI.png

Not sure what you're showing with those last 2 screenshots? Unless a lot has changed since I used it last, you still have to setup client/server side scripts specifically, allowing you to decide where things should be handled. Loading things like hotkey HUDs only on the client, instead of having a server manage 30 objects, specific to a single player, times 100 players, wasting a huge amount of overhead (the way BYOND does). In Box Zombies, for example, I could even instance out the zombie instantiating and AI to each client they were chasing (that's more or less how it works now anyway), and cause practically zero processing overhead on the server, whether there be 1 player or 100,000.
In response to Falacy
Falacy wrote:
Xirre wrote:
Not sure what you're showing with those last 2 screenshots?

There's only one.

Unless a lot has changed since I used it last, you still have to setup client/server side scripts specifically allowing you to decide where things should be handled.

For things like local player movement, if you don't mind them having that ability, you can just check if they are the local player and attach the required sync components (animation or transform or both).

For things server-side required, just send a message to the server. It's really not that hard. Probably no more than 4 lines of code. The script also has it to whether or not the player has authority to manipulate the object. With that, you can conjure up something.

Loading things like hotkey HUDs only on the client, instead of having a server manage 30 objects, specific to a player, times 100 players, wasting a huge amount of overhead (the way BYOND does).

I don't follow... Why would the server have to manage the GUI of each individual player if you are loading it client side and not updating it via the server? The GUI, literally 99% of the time, should never be server-side. Primarily because there's nothing they can do with it that would be bug abusing.

However, actions in the GUI are more likely to be something that should be server-side to prevent cheating. Things like duplication and spam clicking. But, that's a simple procedure that I'm sure would never cause problems. Otherwise, I wouldn't have been able to loop through a list of thousands of objects in a few seconds. They have the power to process that much in a little time. Especially when it's broken up. Other than that, to handle items, just make sure things are synced every so often with the server. Nothing major. If you sanitize properly, you save yourself some server-side required checks.

Perhaps you should also look in to utilizing threads in your Unity projects? One thing I can say, as a heads up, don't overuse threads. You'll lose your computer. As in, you won't be able to use it unless you wait it out or shut it down forcefully (hold your power button/plug it out). CTRL+ALT+DEL doesn't help in this situation either.

---

My point here is: The old GUI, the one you could only program in, could be handled client side. And, the new GUI in 4.6+ and 5.x is also handled client-side. Not only that, the new GUI has the ability to handle button input. Meaning, customizing your scripts is easier now than it ever was. Plus, there's anchors. So, no need for scripting that either.

With all that being said, I'm still confused why you think that the GUI would cause issues with the server.

In response to Xirre
Xirre wrote:
There's only one.

Oh, I completely missed the video link, and was just referring to the download page and screenshot.

I don't follow... Why would the server have to manage the GUI of each individual player if you are loading it client side and not updating it via the server? The GUI, literally 99% of the time, should never be server-side. Primarily because there's nothing they can do with it that would be bug abusing.
[...]
With all that being said, I'm still confused why you think that the GUI would cause issues with the server.

I was comparing it to the way BYOND handles everything server side, and wastes huge amounts of processing overhead for things that should be 100% client sided (like HUDs).
lol hu is a dragon ki rip
In response to Cloud4678
Cloud4678 wrote:
lol hu is a dragon ki rip

No, those games are all edits of the same source. Something BYOND still refuses to deal with properly, by having some sort of "mod" listing section, and listing a DBZ game on the main page, after FUNimation shut them down for it, is just ridiculous.
all this post did was copy Rod5 lol
In response to Mikeche
Mikeche wrote:
all this post did was copy Rod5 lol

You mean the video he made almost two weeks after I posted this? Yea, I copied him hardcore. Either way, you don't need to copy/paste ideas to tell what a low quality crap scam BYOND is, just a simple assessment of the homepage. Also, his video seems to be an attempt to promote a Naruto rip... by saying Zeta rips are bad...
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCwGQTaEEmy3R9n2_lJ0jB8A I can't help but feel like he is Trinimmortal. In that case, I love him.
In response to Xirre
Xirre wrote:
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCwGQTaEEmy3R9n2_lJ0jB8A I can't help but feel like he is Trinimmortal. In that case, I love him.

I actually thought this too when I saw the video LOL
Tested the web client again, almost 9 months later, still seems utterly broken and unusable. Runs at about half a frame per second, and lags the entire browser, so its hard to even test it effectively. client.screen/HUD doesn't seem to show at all (possibly a new layering issue, some layering issues seemed fixed, some didn't, this one wasn't there before), the resource download happened at about 50-100 kb, on a loopback IP, which had about 50-100x that speed available, and the download still happens every time I try to connect, audio doesn't seem to work, graphical glitches and other bugs everywhere. Wasn't this thing supposedly fully functional except for an audio licensing issue like 5+ years ago? GG

EDIT: After testing a few more games:

ROTP: Only lagged browser during download process, which was still at 50ish kb, game ran relatively smooth, but there were still a ton of graphical bugs, parts of the HUD missing, and other issues that made the game unplayable, the interface was also oddly centered, but that could likely be designed around.

HU: Lags only during download, download actually seemed to be at a proper speed, game runs very smooth, HUD seems to render, however hotkeys/macros aren't loaded, which makes the game unplayable, sound effects on the title seemed to play here, music didn't, couldn't test other sound effects due to missing controls, various input() methods wouldn't appear. Instead of turfs having /mob/Player/verb/Add_Friend(), they now show Remove_Friend(), progress?

Every issue that was there nearly a year ago, still seems to be there, or worse.

EDIT 2.0: On an unrelated note to the web client, it seems Dream Daemon no longer displays the name of the hosted game when you mouseover it in the taskbar.