Botman wrote:

Skysaw wrote:

Botman wrote:

Skysaw wrote:

Botman wrote:

Actually, you'll find that words change with time. Reguardless of what your older generation may think, "this" generation has adpoted the term Gen X, while the older generations have labled it Gen Next. Face it, your behind the times.

Hah! We were using the term "Generation X" when you were still in diapers.

Now who's behind the times?

You, and yourve proved it more than ever. Reguardless of what think or say "we" have adopted the term to refur to "us". So moan all you want, its not going to change anything.

We've used it and moved on. You picked it up. That makes YOU behind the times. In other words, you are doing exactly what we did a generation ago.

We have since moved on. By definition, you are behind the times.

Nice bit of flawed logic there. Heck, it almost made sence. We didnt just "pick up" Gex X, we changed the meaning of it. How does that made us behind the times? Im not the one who though it still ment 35 year olds or something.

"Changed the meaning" how? By saying it used to mean this generation, but now it means that generation? Oooh... how original! Sounds a lot like the way you guys are always trying to say why YOUR dbz game is different than all the the others. Or how your music is saying something that wasn't already said (and better) by someone else twenty years ago.

Just to clear things up, we should come up with a brand new name for your generation. How about Gen-We-Ran-Outta-Ideas?

Lummox JR wrote:

But the first of their style? Man, there were angry-loud-screamer groups out there well before Limp Bizkit. Their style is nothing especially fresh.

Lummox JR

Sex Pistols come to mind. Anyone for 1975?

And they were much, much more controversial than those limp guys.

For a start this is cheating, your replying to an old post.

It makes you part of a brain-dead subculture too stupid to bother to learn the meanings behind what it's saying.

Welcome to the future. A generation that isnt scared to do what it wants.

Extremely and horrifically wrong. The N word is still offensive to many (though in some limited contexts it would be acceptable), and while the F word may not offend you personally, it's still vulgar. This linguistic relativism of yours is asinine. Languages do change over time, but not nearly as quickly as you suggest. Moreover, the meaning of a word generally tends to retain its original connotation for a long time.

Grr, listen, please. I know the N word is still offensive to many. To many older people. Aside from repeating Gughunter reguarding context, I should point out, it was a negro on ABC world news who is an expert in Social Studies and racism who I'm quoting when I say "The youth of today has decided No, I'm not going to be offended by the word nigger, I'm pround of it and will embrace it". You see it as an insult. We dont. Simple.

I wasn't talking about your group of friends' views on profanity. I was talking about what is and isn't profanity. Black and white. Some words are cuss words. Deal with it.

Yeah, but so what? Just because they are a profanity, doesnt mean they are still used as an insult.

The fact that you don't have a problem saying this stuff around your friends or vice-versa is irrelevant to the meaning and content. This is not an "our generation" thing, and each comment you make along those lines only pegs you as a cretin. You've bought in way too easily to a lot of popular myths, but you can't really defend them without spouting off a dozen more.

Either that or your just refusing to accept the truth and dont like the way things are going. Perhaps youd agree more if I said its an enviromental thing. The environment we have grown up in has lead us to view many of these things as being acceptable. To be honest, I'm surprised someone of your intelligence would doubt this.

Swearing is profanity by definition. If you can call it swearing, it's also profanity, and vice-versa. That's what the words mean. Do you actually speak English or what?

What the heck is your point? Get with it. Swearing for us doesnt carry the weight it once did. Its as simple as that. Im starting to doubt you really are very inteligent, the same way Im refurring to endless cliches about generation x etc, your giving the views of a blatantly stereotypical parent. I might as well go try to convince my Dad to like LB, at least that would be productive.

And you have completely missed my point. My point is not that you remove the offense from a word by overuse, but that you remove its meaning. It becomes less meaningful in your speech than a word like "the"; it's complete white noise, and you're including it in every sentence for no reason whatsoever.

The reason is because in what I can only call an attempt to "rebell", its cool. And see, now yourve gotten the point. The swearing in LB etc isnt ment as offensive, its ment to appeal to "us", and frankly, it does.

Poetry remains popular, though often it takes time and maturity to learn to appreciate it, or to be able to figure out what the poet is saying. Poetry is also key to writing a good song, because the ability to express an idea through lyrics is limited by a time factor.

What use is it though if people just ignore it? Take Eminem. When you take the time to look past the marketing ploy that is his controversy, he actually has great skill.

I really cant say I see much in the way of poetry in ever day life (while I see planty of music, tv, advertising etc). It may remain popular to many, but I think its become increasingly less mainsteam. Or maybe it never did greatly apeal to youth. Perhaps it is one art form than requires maturity to fully appreciate.

You've completely ignored my point about the richness of language involved in making a good poem, while making another one of your rock stupid "my generation/your generation" statements. Come the heck off that point, man; it's making you look like an idiot.

Its not my problem if you dont like the truth. The generation gap is cleary the defining difference here.

I love the way you used the word "man", like a true youthful sole.

Another brainless generation comment.

Yup, keep using insults to deny the truth.

You're right about one thing, though: The common doesn't stand out. That has been a constant throughout human history and won't change no matter how old you get.

Anyway, you missed what I ment? I'm saying swearing will become common place when we grow up, not that being common will stand out.

No, I said they weren't bubble gum pop. Limp Bizkit doesn't even come close to bubble gum pop; it's a completely different genre, and I've already said so. Are you paying attention or what?

Not really. My attention span in interest in this thread was shot long ago. Im not too sure why Im even still posting. I think i'll stop soon.

Agreed; they're not a hip hop band.
But the first of their style? Man (go you young thing), there were angry-loud-screamer groups out there well before Limp Bizkit. Their style is nothing especially fresh.

I still cant think of any bands similar to LB (cept maybe Linkon Park, ther are pretty shouty, but less rap). As I said before, I'd be happy to hear some names.

Botman wrote:

For a start this is cheating, your replying to an old post.

It makes you part of a brain-dead subculture too stupid to bother to learn the meanings behind what it's saying.

Welcome to the future. A generation that isnt scared to do what it wants.

Stupidity is not something to be embraced, nor proud of. If your "generation" (I wish you'd have the brains to stop abusing that term), by which I mean you and your friends, twist the meanings of every word you learn--or, as you've aptly demonstrated, fail to learn--you're going to get about as much respect as pimps in an art gallery. Contrary to your belief, there are plenty of people in any generation who don't succumb to the lies of linguistic relativism as completely as you have. The leaders of any given culture are those who maintain true focus, clear sight, and can communicate effectively; conversely, there are always putzes who equate mass ignorance with pride in their generation.

Grr, listen, please. I know the N word is still offensive to many. To many older people.

To many younger people too. There are lots of contexts where this word is a Bad Idea. Your refusal to characterize this as anything but an old/young schism is absolutely irrational. Buy yourself a clue.

Aside from repeating Gughunter reguarding context, I should point out, it was a negro on ABC world news who is an expert in Social Studies and racism who I'm quoting when I say "The youth of today has decided No, I'm not going to be offended by the word nigger, I'm pround of it and will embrace it". You see it as an insult. We dont. Simple.

Not simple. You're talking about a single voice from a mouthpiece that's prone to say such things, and in fact it too is wrong when it's referring to the youth of "today". As I explained in another post, the "friendly" contexts of the N word have existed for a very long time. The unfriendly ones haven't gone away, even among younger people.

I wasn't talking about your group of friends' views on profanity. I was talking about what is and isn't profanity. Black and white. Some words are cuss words. Deal with it.

Yeah, but so what? Just because they are a profanity, doesnt mean they are still used as an insult.

Nor did I say anything about profanity as it relates to insults.

The fact that you don't have a problem saying this stuff around your friends or vice-versa is irrelevant to the meaning and content. This is not an "our generation" thing, and each comment you make along those lines only pegs you as a cretin. You've bought in way too easily to a lot of popular myths, but you can't really defend them without spouting off a dozen more.

Either that or your just refusing to accept the truth and dont like the way things are going. Perhaps youd agree more if I said its an enviromental thing. The environment we have grown up in has lead us to view many of these things as being acceptable. To be honest, I'm surprised someone of your intelligence would doubt this.

You just made my point for me, spouting off more of those myths, like "the way things are going". The phenomenon you speak of is absolutely nothing new.

If you want to call this an environmental thing, you're closer to the truth than with your loony "generation" nonsense. It is of course no surprise that a bunch of people who go to the same school, or live in the same area, etc., will grow up with some similarities in their value system. They will also tend to absorb the same foolish cutural lies.

Swearing is profanity by definition. If you can call it swearing, it's also profanity, and vice-versa. That's what the words mean. Do you actually speak English or what?

What the heck is your point? Get with it. Swearing for us doesnt carry the weight it once did. Its as simple as that. Im starting to doubt you really are very inteligent, the same way Im refurring to endless cliches about generation x etc, your giving the views of a blatantly stereotypical parent. I might as well go try to convince my Dad to like LB, at least that would be productive.

My point was, you said swearing wasn't necessarily profanity. But it is profanity, because that's the definition of the word. Whether it's offensive, however, is an entirely separate concept.

You're also making a rash assumption in assuming I'm an entire generation older than you, or that I'm a parent. I'm not a parent, and I have probably half a generation at best in age difference from you. By saying that I'm making an assumption, that you're in an age group from about 12 to 18, but I'm guessing I'm right on that call. You have all the brash "I know all the answers" smugness of a typical teenager, but with less brains than most.

I haven't seen you refer to any cliches about Generation X; the only thing you've said about it is to insist that the term has a variable meaning that can be warped to mean "the current generation". Well, it doesn't, nor is an elephant a giraffe or a breadbox a watermelon. You have to face up to the fact that although your friends may all use the phrase "Generation X" the same way you do, they (and you) use it that way because you learned it incorrectly, thought it meant something it didn't, and have been consistently misusing it ever since. It would be just as incorrect to call yourself a baby boomer, for the exact same reasons.

And you have completely missed my point. My point is not that you remove the offense from a word by overuse, but that you remove its meaning. It becomes less meaningful in your speech than a word like "the"; it's complete white noise, and you're including it in every sentence for no reason whatsoever.

The reason is because in what I can only call an attempt to "rebell", its cool. And see, now yourve gotten the point. The swearing in LB etc isnt ment as offensive, its ment to appeal to "us", and frankly, it does.

No doubt it does appeal to those who confuse swearing with rebellion, or profanity with deep and insightful meaning. Of course, if you consider a word to be completely inoffensive, one wonders why you would associated it with rebellion in the first place.

Poetry remains popular, though often it takes time and maturity to learn to appreciate it, or to be able to figure out what the poet is saying. Poetry is also key to writing a good song, because the ability to express an idea through lyrics is limited by a time factor.

What use is it though if people just ignore it? Take Eminem. When you take the time to look past the marketing ploy that is his controversy, he actually has great skill.

Frankly I don't see it. Eminem is funny, but only because his "annoying white rapper" bit is a novelty. I haven't seen anything from him to convince me of skill on his part. That doesn't mean he has none, of course, but maybe the novelty is really all he has going for him.
Don't you dare drag out another stupid "You just don't get it because you're older" response here.

I really cant say I see much in the way of poetry in ever day life (while I see planty of music, tv, advertising etc). It may remain popular to many, but I think its become increasingly less mainsteam. Or maybe it never did greatly apeal to youth. Perhaps it is one art form than requires maturity to fully appreciate.

I think poetry does appeal to youth, but less so than to adults. You're right on that count, that it takes some maturity to begin to really get poetry. However, a very good poem can carry shockingly clear meanings through to even young audiences, and in music it helps to take advantage of this.

You've completely ignored my point about the richness of language involved in making a good poem, while making another one of your rock stupid "my generation/your generation" statements. Come the heck off that point, man; it's making you look like an idiot.

Its not my problem if you dont like the truth. The generation gap is cleary the defining difference here.

There is no generation gap. That's just your twisted, boneheaded, wrong worldview getting in the way again. What you're defending is not a generation but a subculture, and others share that subculture who are even older than you. To imply that your "generation" is somehow massively different from those even slightly before it is ridiculous, and neither history nor truth bear out your point.

Another brainless generation comment.

Yup, keep using insults to deny the truth.

What you've been saying isn't "the truth", but only a skewed interpretation of the world through your own opinions. The truth is, your "generation" is a vast group of people that extends beyond your circle of friends, your school, or your country, and its tastes are wide and varied. Its values vary significantly, as do its viewpoints. You have one particular viewpoint, that you seem to perceive you share with others (how many others, one can never know), and stupidly insist that that's the way your "generation" sees everything.

Anyway, you missed what I ment? I'm saying swearing will become common place when we grow up, not that being common will stand out.

Swearing has been around for centuries. One could argue that it's more common today than 50 years ago, or 100 maybe, but I strongly doubt the next 20 to 50 years will see significantly more swearing than today.
In order to be truly eloquent, a much greater vocabulary and richer forms of expression are required. And the eloquent, like it or not, drive society, because they're the ones who can make themselves heard amid a chaos of a thousand ideas. No matter how accepted profanity becomes in mainstream society, there will always be those who recognize that to be heard, they must distance themselves from it.

No, I said they weren't bubble gum pop. Limp Bizkit doesn't even come close to bubble gum pop; it's a completely different genre, and I've already said so. Are you paying attention or what?

Not really. My attention span in interest in this thread was shot long ago. Im not too sure why Im even still posting. I think i'll stop soon.

This is precisely my point, though. In lots of cases you've shown you didn't know what you were talking about, or worse that you didn't even understand what others were talking about. You have not argued your point rationally.

Lummox JR