In response to Deadron (#19)
Deadron wrote:
[snip]
Anyway, some day maybe the Linux community will wake up and realize that all the things they are hoping will show up for Linux "some day" exist in Mac OS X today and they can start putting their energies into something useful.

Like getting OS X to be completely open source?
In response to Mertek (#6)
Wow, I actually never call anything not living by a name, just seems..kind a creepy, but anyway, I have a PC, 6 years old, who said PCs can't last a long time??!!! =)
In response to ADDiCt (#21)
I never really personify any of my items, but on the odd chance i refer to my computer as Rus...Dont ask why, I just do.
In response to Foomer (#18)
There are only three reasons to get a mac. Either you don't know how to use a computer, you like making your own music, or you like making graphics. It's good for that but nothing else.

They are more expensive, they have way less software, they can't do something called multi-tasking, they can't eject disks when the computer is off, they have no right mouse button, they look like a childrens toy, no company actually uses them so knowing how to use them will never help you, and they aren't as customizable. I could go on all day :p

Basically, if your someones Gramma, a musician, or a graphics artist then get one.

I'm not praising windows though, it also sucks but it's better than OS X. Windows XP and Windows Me really seem to suck though, I think Windows 98 and Windows 2000 were the best.

Everyone go to mp3.com and download "Every OS sucks" from Three Dead Trolls in a Baggy :)
In response to Deadron (#19)
Deadron wrote:
Dude you must get yourself VirtualPC. It is an excellent program that lets you run Windows along with everything else.

Yeah, I've been thinking about it. I wish they'd provide a trial version for Mac so I can evaluate its performance before I purchase it. I do have plenty of other options for using BYOND, including a couple of real Windows PCs, plus emulation on FreeBSD (which doesn't have to emulate the CPU, so it's nearly as fast as native Windows). It's still tempting though, I may purchase the downloadable version with DOS in a moment of weakness and install my own copy of Win98.
In response to Air Mapster (#24)
I used to like macs alot and they are not bad but I prefer Windows better becuase it is actually easier to me to work with and I know alot of the programs options anything, in other words I am a genuis with windows compared to Macs, do you like the mouse thing? Thats one thing I do not like about the mac system, and the window things becuase that one button.

Stealth2k
In response to English (#23)
English wrote:
There are only three reasons to get a mac. Either you don't know how to use a computer, you like making your own music, or you like making graphics. It's good for that but nothing else.

They are more expensive, they have way less software, they can't do something called multi-tasking, they can't eject disks when the computer is off, they have no right mouse button, they look like a childrens toy, no company actually uses them so knowing how to use them will never help you, and they aren't as customizable. I could go on all day :p

Basically, if your someones Gramma, a musician, or a graphics artist then get one.

I'm not praising windows though, it also sucks but it's better than OS X. Windows XP and Windows Me really seem to suck though, I think Windows 98 and Windows 2000 were the best.

Everyone go to mp3.com and download "Every OS sucks" from Three Dead Trolls in a Baggy :)

They can eject disks when turned off, they have right mouse buttons, they have very nice designs(Who wouldn't want a computer in the shape of a lamp?). I have to say that Windows is nowhere near as good as OSX, its not even close in my eyes.

Alathon
In response to Alathon (#26)
No mac I've ever seen had a right mouse button and they couldn't eject disks when it was off either.

Most of them were at the JC i'm going to and the lab assistant said they were G4's so it isn't like they were ancient computers.

Even if it does have those things you haven't disputed everything else I've said about it :p
In response to English (#27)
English wrote:
No mac I've ever seen had a right mouse button and they couldn't eject disks when it was off either.

Most of them were at the JC i'm going to and the lab assistant said they were G4's so it isn't like they were ancient computers.

Even if it does have those things you haven't disputed everything else I've said about it :p

OSX is just as customizable as any windows system as far as I know. And every single mac ive EVER had or tried, since I was 5 was able to eject disks when turned off. I saw a 10 year old mac with the capability to do so. They have, to my knowledge almost alwease been able to do that. Theres a little hole which you stick a pin into, which ejects a disk.

There are plenty of 3 button mouses out there for macs, logitech etc.

Alathon
In response to English (#23)
Ugh. I swear this will be my last reply on this subthread, no long flame wars please. ;-)

English wrote:
There are only three reasons to get a mac. Either you don't know how to use a computer, you like making your own music, or you like making graphics. It's good for that but nothing else.

That's true. Macs can't connect to the internet, run Microsoft Office, any games whatsoever, manage your personal finances, run scientific calculations, perform as web servers, file servers, database servers, or anything else computers are used for. Quite true.

they can't do something called multi-tasking

That's right. Mac OS X is based on that ancient operating system called Unix, from 1970. When are they going to join the 21st century and add multi-tasking to that thing? Unix is a joke, only able to run one program at a time. It even came before DOS, which was a big improvement.

they can't eject disks when the computer is off

Show me a PC that can eject the CDROM when it is off. I've never seen one. As for floppies, I haven't used one in years. When will the rest of the computer world catch up and stop including that useless drive in everything? 1.44MB? Please. You can't even fit BYOND on that.

they have no right mouse button

$20 at the local computer store gets you a 3-button USB mouse that works seamlessly with Mac OS X, right-click menus and all. They can do it, but they don't need to.

no company actually uses them so knowing how to use them will never help you

Plenty do. Just not in boring coporate America. But as Deadron pointed out, knowing one OS doesn't preclude you from using another. If you have trouble switching between Mac OS and Windows, you probably shouldn't be using a computer at work anyway.

and they aren't as customizable.

That's strange. Here's what Apple has to say about the Mac I'm getting. And that's just the tip of the iceberg. And the fact that I can't build my own Mac from a mish-mash of cheap parts isn't a drawback to me. It's one thing that makes the Macintosh such a more pleasant user experience: Apple makes both the hardware and software, and can therefore guarantee that it works well. Neither Microsoft nor any PC maker can do that since they don't have control over the complete system.

I could go on all day :p

I suggest you check your facts before doing so. ;-)

Basically, if your someones Gramma, a musician, or a graphics artist then get one.

Or if you want to just use your computer rather than fight with it. ;-)

I'm not praising windows though, it also sucks but it's better than OS X.

That's your opinion and I respect that. I strongly disagree, but that's ok with me.

Everyone go to mp3.com and download "Every OS sucks" from Three Dead Trolls in a Baggy :)

Heh. As the writer of my favorite mail program said, "All mail clients suck. This one just sucks less." Same can be said for operating systems and computers in general. I'd say that about Macs, but that's just me. To each his own. ;-)
In response to Air Mapster (#29)
That's true. Macs can't connect to the internet, run Microsoft Office, any games whatsoever, manage your personal finances, run scientific calculations, perform as web servers, file servers, database servers, or anything else computers are used for. Quite true.

I meant Windows can do those things better. If one option is better you should choose it over the inferrior option, that's all I was saying. Macs are superior at making graphics and music, but that's about it.


When are they going to join the 21st century and add multi->tasking to that thing?

I'm glad you agree :) The G4's have a tendency to crash when I usr Maple, Word, and IE. I can easily have 3-4 programs, and 10-15 different windows on my 350 MGHz old crappy computer with Windows.

Show me a PC that can eject the CDROM when it is off. >I've never seen one.

I haven't either, they should make one.

As for floppies, I haven't used one in years. When will >the rest of the computer world catch up and stop including >that useless drive in everything?

They're usefull because they're backwards compatable and a standard. Not every computer has a zip drive or CDRW so it's a way of transferring information no matter what the computer. Word documents and images can fit on them so it's really handy for transfering them from computer to computer.

they have no right mouse button

I addressed that in my other post, the ones I've used didn't have one so I assumed they didn't, my mistake.


knowing one OS doesn't preclude you from using another. If you have trouble switching between Mac OS and Windows, you probably shouldn't be using a computer at work anyway.

Your right it doesn't, but your more efficient with an OS you use most often. I now many shortcuts and get arround more quickly than most people in windows with them. I can use a mac but I'm about half as fast on one.

and they aren't as customizable.

I was talking software side, not hardware.


Or if you want to just use your computer rather than fight with it. ;-)

Yeah, macs just crash instead of fight :)

That's your opinion and I respect that. I strongly disagree, but that's ok with me.

Same here.
In response to English (#23)
English wrote:
There are only three reasons to get a mac. Either you don't know how to use a computer, you like making your own music, or you like making graphics. It's good for that but nothing else.

Hmm, actually if you use any personal pc for large scale graphical rendering, you're probably sniffing glue. That being said, have you heard of 3d StudioMax, Lightwave, Alias, or any of the other rendering packages that destroy any reason to try to do "graphics" on a Macintrash...err tosh.

They are more expensive, they have way less software, they can't do something called multi-tasking, they can't eject disks when the computer is off, they have no right mouse button, they look like a childrens toy, no company actually uses them so knowing how to use them will never help you, and they aren't as customizable. I could go on all day :p

Well, I hear this OS X is a real humdinger based on a Unix core, so multitasking should be no sweat. I'm glad they finally wised up and nuked their crappy kernel....

Basically, if your someones Gramma, a musician, or a graphics artist then get one.

See note 1. Also, PCs have a wide variety of outstanding MIDI and MP3 software. Can't see why you'd bother to waste your time with a Mac.....

I'm not praising windows though, it also sucks but it's better than OS X. Windows XP and Windows Me really seem to suck though, I think Windows 98 and Windows 2000 were the best.

You must be kidding. Win 98 was a horrible abomination cursed with clinical instability. I don't know why any sane human being would ever infect their system with that "thing". Win 200 is pretty good stuff except for its GLARING SECURITY ISSUES. That being said, it is my OS of choice.

Everyone go to mp3.com and download "Every OS sucks" from Three Dead Trolls in a Baggy :)

This is true. Except for *nix. And OS X if it really lives up to its promises.

-James
In response to Alathon (#26)
I've never used a decent Mac, but I do know that my PC, in fact, every PC I've ever had is a piece of junk. That's not to praise Mac though, because in my opinion every man-made computer is a piece of junk. :oP

All the old macs I used to use crashed a lot. But then, so do most old computers. And even though they crashed, at least it was a nice freeze and they would start up clean again. My old PC would give me nice blue fatal errors, screw up my programs, and insist that I find a set of step-by-step startup procedures that worked before it would let me use it again. I hate that old machine. My current machine is nice, it crashes on occasion but not hardly as often as ol' Polly did. Windows ME is probably the most stable windows I've had so far, but then it might just be that I'm a little more careful about what kind of crap I load into it, after my experiences with Polly.

My nice Pavilion hasn't destroyed any of my hard-earned files yet, so that's a plus. The CD burner doesn't hurt though. Now my only beef is with the MSN subscription that came with, since it took me 3 months to get that darn program out of my computer, because it liked to take over things. EVIL MSN!! I finally got that plague out though, and she's been running relatively smooth ever since.
In response to English (#30)
I said I wouldn't respond, but I can't let misinformation go uncorrected. Sadly I think that's a big reason why so many people still turn up their noses at the mere mention of Apple or Macintosh. Machine Always Crashes If Not The Operating System Hangs was not always an undeserved acronym for legacy MacOS versions, and that's what people remember.

Again, I'm not looking to change anyone's opinion or prove my "correctness." Just want to clear up one little thing...

English wrote:
When are they going to join the 21st century and add multi->tasking to that thing?

I'm glad you agree :) The G4's have a tendency to crash when I usr Maple, Word, and IE. I can easily have 3-4 programs, and 10-15 different windows on my 350 MGHz old crappy computer with Windows.
...
Yeah, macs just crash instead of fight :)

Clearly you're talking about Classic MacOS. In that case, I completely agree. Just as with Win9x, a poorly configured MacOS Classic will crash if you look at it funny. Classic MacOS was nice in its day, before Windows was anything more than a DOS oddity, but it most definitely overstayed its welcome and was left in the dust by Windows.

Mac OS X suffers none of these problems. It takes nearly an act of god to crash any decent commercial-grade Unix, including Mac OS X. As with any Unix, I'm sure it has a few issues here and there, but I'll bet money that it's more stable than any Microsoft OS under similarly heavy load.

Just wanted to make sure that the above statements don't get incorrectly applied to OS X, that's all. Sorry for wasting forum space again. ;-)
In response to English (#23)
English wrote:
There are only three reasons to get a mac. Either you don't know how to use a computer, you like making your own music, or you like making graphics. It's good for that but nothing else.

Almost everything you said in your message is factually incorrect. Please realize that Mac OS X is not Mac OS, and you've clearly never used Mac OS X, or if you did you didn't pay any attention to little features like vastly better multi-tasking than Windows, and the availability of multi-button mice, etc.

I'd suggest you stop posting complete inaccuracies until you learn a few things about the system you are criticizing.
Ew! You're a Mac lover!
In response to ACWraith (#20)
ACWraith wrote:
Like getting OS X to be completely open source?

Just as much of OS X is open source as Linux.

The entire Unix core is the Darwin open source project.

The GUI is not open-source, but then neither is Linux's, because Linux doesn't have one. You can run X11 on top of Linux...and you can run X11 on top of OSX.

So it's the same situation.
In response to Air Mapster (#29)
Air Mapster wrote:

Show me a PC that can eject the CDROM when it is off. I've never seen one. As for floppies, I haven't used one in years. When will the rest of the computer world catch up and stop including that useless drive in everything? 1.44MB? Please. You can't even fit BYOND on that.

The lack of a floppy drive in Macs is what makes me hate them the most. These past few months floppy drives have been the most useful drive on my computer (except the hard drive of course). Floppies are big enough to hold those little files that you have to give to a friend in the morning and they are the only reason my computer is working right now, sometimes that is the only way to boot my computer after I have changed some setting I shouldn't have. With Macs you have to re-image the whole darn thing and you'll lose all of your stuff if you mess it up. I have other issues about them but I don't want to start listing them because most of them are strictly opinion based ( even more than this one is). Long live the PC and linux!
I've got a little network going at the house with these computer names:

Network domain is: Wonderland

  • CheshireCat: a Pentium2-350Mhz Windows98 box, used primarily by the kids for playing games.
  • Madhatter: my Pentium-MMX-267Mhz Linux laptop. It is particualrly 'mad' because of the split Linux/Windoze partitions...
  • Doormouse: a P-MMX-166Mhz Windows98 box that my girlfriend uses for writing her University papers on.
  • Alice: another P-MMX-166Mhz Linux/Windows98 box that I use as a home workstation...mostly for programming PHP, Java, (and now Byond!), and for running some games (like Quake2 and StarCraft) and the occasional SETI client. Also acts as a master console for my last two machines:
  • WhiteRabbit: Our home's firewall, router, and fileserver running a P2-200Mhz with Peanut Linux...also does multiple SETI clients in the background...
  • Tweedle-dee and Tweedle-dum: a 486DX4-100Mhz and 486DX2-66Mhz. Both are Linux boxes running as slaves to Alice in my latest toy project: a Scalable Cluster Environment - yessir: my very own super computer! Ok, granted there ain't much horsepower there, but I have 4 more P-MMX 150Mhz motherboards just waiting for powersupplies and then they can join the cluster too!


Interestingly, the only computer that was paid for was Cheshirecat, and that was $1000 new at the time. The others were given to me by clients who were practically throwing the stuff out!
It appears that my computer's name is " slkdfjiewjl w;ljlk," thanks to my 15 month old daughter.
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