Whats the point of the "Train" verb in DBZ games? in Off Topic

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ID:99475
 
Jul 30 2010, 4:50 pm
What im asking is wheres the fun in it?

I never understood whats about it that makes people want to idle for like 5-14 hours of their days just to watch their stats gain up.

In my opinion, MMORPGs are just time waisters that offer you just running around doing various pointless tasks and defeating monsters with brainless AI capability. And basically you just do that for hours inorder get a certain ability that other players don't have.

The point I tried to make in that mini-rant is that at least basic MMOs had more interactive methods on training. But if you have to add a verb that makes you gaining stats idly then you know theres something wrong with your combat system.

When I first saw a DBZ BYOND game on youtube, I didn't even know what BYOND was at the time. But all it showed on the game itself was a gym system. Attack punching bags, Defense punching bags, and the rest of that which put me to sleep. The a year later I started playing BYOND, and yes in my noob days I played DBZ and all sorts of rips and eventually found out it was all pointless idling grindfests.

Functions like this is why I prefer BYOND RP games over most BYOND RPG games since in rpgs are just idle grinding such as I stated above while most RP games make you actually earn your abilities, titles, and things. Makes the game more realistic and enoyable then certain rpg games.
#1 Jul 30 2010, 4:54 pm
Instant gratification in being 'strong'

It's all about the epeen.
#2 Jul 30 2010, 6:34 pm
Neither do I.
It's a shame how all of the legitimate games that involve actually working for your stats(i.e killing monsters, quests, etc) are overshadowed by verb-whoring games that have no purpose to them but to grind your stats all day.
#3 Jul 30 2010, 6:39 pm
Everyone can complain all they want about the "train" verb on Dragonball games, but I mean, part of the Dragonball franchise was training.

Most if not all the main characters in Dragonball/Z trained day and night to become strong enough to defeat their enemies.

In one of the GBA iterations of Dragonball Z there is an actual punching bag you can hit for XP.
#4 Jul 30 2010, 7:39 pm
It's the lack of sense of reality that draws people in, as well as subconscious convenience.

Some people want to just be great at something to brag later, but not have to put a lot of effort into it. They want to feel powerful -- even if it is virtually.

Others, just don't have a vast and imaginative grasp -- as well as a good sense of quality gameplay -- to ignore the pitiful things such as AFK-Train-Verbs.
#5 Jul 30 2010, 8:24 pm
Ham Doctor wrote:
Everyone can complain all they want about the "train" verb on Dragonball games, but I mean, part of the Dragonball franchise was training.

Most if not all the main characters in Dragonball/Z trained day and night to become strong enough to defeat their enemies.

In one of the GBA iterations of Dragonball Z there is an actual punching bag you can hit for XP.

Yeah, but the training in DBZ never involved punching in mid-air for no reason. Well they did something like that in Dragon Ball Z:Infinite World, but that game was shit.
#6 Jul 30 2010, 9:07 pm
People who are great at afk-ing love it. Like power hungry kids who get insta-happy from the fact they clicked a homing rapid ki-blast to kill someone.

I also hate the people that refuse something is cheap because it makes em good. Makes me wonder if games purposely create imbalance in certain areas because they realize most people wanna come in and "Be the best". Then make "balances" that actually are used to create new imbalances.. To keep players interested. I seen this happen on some DBZ games too.
#7 Jul 30 2010, 9:32 pm
@ Chidori123;

Imbalances tend to bring in more players. It's addicting.
You're either A) Going to be power-hungry and side with the un-fair advantages or B) Challenge yourself and be the under-dog.
There's usually never a chance where a player is in-between A and B.
#8 Jul 30 2010, 9:37 pm
Ham Doctor wrote:
Everyone can complain all they want about the "train" verb on Dragonball games, but I mean, part of the Dragonball franchise was training.

Most if not all the main characters in Dragonball/Z trained day and night to become strong enough to defeat their enemies.

In one of the GBA iterations of Dragonball Z there is an actual punching bag you can hit for XP.
---
You've missed the concept entirely.
Plus Son Goku and friends didn't just go hey, I'm going stand in one spot for 4747 hours and wave my arms around.
#9 Jul 30 2010, 9:37 pm
Coolman1250 wrote:
Ham Doctor wrote:
Everyone can complain all they want about the "train" verb on Dragonball games, but I mean, part of the Dragonball franchise was training.

Most if not all the main characters in Dragonball/Z trained day and night to become strong enough to defeat their enemies.

In one of the GBA iterations of Dragonball Z there is an actual punching bag you can hit for XP.

Yeah, but the training in DBZ never involved punching in mid-air for no reason. Well they did something like that in Dragon Ball Z:Infinite World, but that game was shit.

There was a few scenes in Dragonball Z where they showed one of the Z-Fighters training like that, punching in the air, doing sit-ups or even fighting one another.
#10 Jul 30 2010, 9:39 pm
PerfectGoku wrote:
Ham Doctor wrote:
Everyone can complain all they want about the "train" verb on Dragonball games, but I mean, part of the Dragonball franchise was training.

Most if not all the main characters in Dragonball/Z trained day and night to become strong enough to defeat their enemies.

In one of the GBA iterations of Dragonball Z there is an actual punching bag you can hit for XP.
---
You've missed the concept entirely.
Plus Son Goku and friends didn't just go hey, I'm going stand in one spot for 4747 hours and wave my arms around.

Who fucking even cares? It's a game, if you don't like the mechanics then don't play the game.
#11 Jul 30 2010, 9:44 pm
Ham Doctor wrote:
PerfectGoku wrote:
Ham Doctor wrote:
Everyone can complain all they want about the "train" verb on Dragonball games, but I mean, part of the Dragonball franchise was training.

Most if not all the main characters in Dragonball/Z trained day and night to become strong enough to defeat their enemies.

In one of the GBA iterations of Dragonball Z there is an actual punching bag you can hit for XP.
---
You've missed the concept entirely.
Plus Son Goku and friends didn't just go hey, I'm going stand in one spot for 4747 hours and wave my arms around.

Who fucking even cares? It's a game, if you don't like the mechanics then don't play the game.
---
Then don't compare a shitty game to the series when the two are nothing alike.
You failed at justifying the similarities of training on an average Dragon Ball rip and the actual series.
#12 Jul 31 2010, 12:10 am
As far as I remember in the DB series related to training, different people trained you in order to become stronger. The difference between the training in DB series and the games is what (I think) perfectgoku pointed out was that you didn't stand in one spot and hit thin air. You actually had to do something to get stronger, but then again this is fan-based games. What can you honestly expect from a person who wanted something simple and not complex? I'm sure the person who these sources came from didn't want to spend hours on in perfecting the training systems to make sure it's similiar to the show or he probably thought that if he tried to get it right, it would take hours of trial and errors to get it right and if I were that person I would say, "Oh lets just make something simple like sitting thin air to get "strong"

Out of lazyiness I believe this is why people want a simple function to like what Maggeh had already stated, get instant gratification of being "strong"

I stir clear of these types of games. I rather grind with a party than spend half a day self-training because I'm doing SOMETHING, I'm in involved with the game and I'm having fun. I like games where you can make your character grow over time, not get every ability in a split second.

Not to mention, Dragonball Z games on BYOND are stupid as well as the games for PS2 and crap.

There, I tortured you with this pointless meaningless babble. I probably missed somebody's point as well but hey. I don't really care to sit around debating about it, It's 1:16AM.

Suck the fattest part of my ass.
#13 Jul 31 2010, 4:01 am
You must do what needs to be done to obtain the jutsus.
#14 Jul 31 2010, 1:24 pm
Jedioh wrote:
As far as I remember in the DB series related to training, different people trained you in order to become stronger. The difference between the training in DB series and the games is what (I think) perfectgoku pointed out was that you didn't stand in one spot and hit thin air. You actually had to do something to get stronger, but then again this is fan-based games. What can you honestly expect from a person who wanted something simple and not complex? I'm sure the person who these sources came from didn't want to spend hours on in perfecting the training systems to make sure it's similiar to the show or he probably thought that if he tried to get it right, it would take hours of trial and errors to get it right and if I were that person I would say, "Oh lets just make something simple like sitting thin air to get "strong"

Out of lazyiness I believe this is why people want a simple function to like what Maggeh had already stated, get instant gratification of being "strong"

I stir clear of these types of games. I rather grind with a party than spend half a day self-training because I'm doing SOMETHING, I'm in involved with the game and I'm having fun. I like games where you can make your character grow over time, not get every ability in a split second.

thats not what I meant though, I meant there are more ways to train, such as sparring in general, saiyans get strong for everytime the get hit or get hit by a powerful enemy
#15 Jul 31 2010, 4:16 pm
Coolman1250 wrote:
Jedioh wrote:
As far as I remember in the DB series related to training, different people trained you in order to become stronger. The difference between the training in DB series and the games is what (I think) perfectgoku pointed out was that you didn't stand in one spot and hit thin air. You actually had to do something to get stronger, but then again this is fan-based games. What can you honestly expect from a person who wanted something simple and not complex? I'm sure the person who these sources came from didn't want to spend hours on in perfecting the training systems to make sure it's similiar to the show or he probably thought that if he tried to get it right, it would take hours of trial and errors to get it right and if I were that person I would say, "Oh lets just make something simple like sitting thin air to get "strong"

Out of lazyiness I believe this is why people want a simple function to like what Maggeh had already stated, get instant gratification of being "strong"

I stir clear of these types of games. I rather grind with a party than spend half a day self-training because I'm doing SOMETHING, I'm in involved with the game and I'm having fun. I like games where you can make your character grow over time, not get every ability in a split second.

thats not what I meant though, I meant there are more ways to train, such as sparring in general, saiyans get strong for everytime the get hit or get hit by a powerful enemy
---
No they don't, they get thrilled by the experience. Eventually their energy will wear down, by your logic with every punch they'd become nearly invincible. That can easily be disproved throughout the series.
Example: Frieza beats Vegeta to near death. He never got stronger from Frieza's hits, they fatigued him as they should. Eventually he was thrown to the the ground and he couldn't move.
Frieza finishes him off after Son Goku arrives with a death beam to the heart.

#16 Jul 31 2010, 4:46 pm
PerfectGoku wrote:
Coolman1250 wrote:
Jedioh wrote:
As far as I remember in the DB series related to training, different people trained you in order to become stronger. The difference between the training in DB series and the games is what (I think) perfectgoku pointed out was that you didn't stand in one spot and hit thin air. You actually had to do something to get stronger, but then again this is fan-based games. What can you honestly expect from a person who wanted something simple and not complex? I'm sure the person who these sources came from didn't want to spend hours on in perfecting the training systems to make sure it's similiar to the show or he probably thought that if he tried to get it right, it would take hours of trial and errors to get it right and if I were that person I would say, "Oh lets just make something simple like sitting thin air to get "strong"

Out of lazyiness I believe this is why people want a simple function to like what Maggeh had already stated, get instant gratification of being "strong"

I stir clear of these types of games. I rather grind with a party than spend half a day self-training because I'm doing SOMETHING, I'm in involved with the game and I'm having fun. I like games where you can make your character grow over time, not get every ability in a split second.

thats not what I meant though, I meant there are more ways to train, such as sparring in general, saiyans get strong for everytime the get hit or get hit by a powerful enemy
---
No they don't, they get thrilled by the experience. Eventually their energy will wear down, by your logic with every punch they'd become nearly invincible. That can easily be disproved throughout the series.
Example: Frieza beats Vegeta to near death. He never got stronger from Frieza's hits, they fatigued him as they should. Eventually he was thrown to the the ground and he couldn't move.
Frieza finishes him off after Son Goku arrives with a death beam to the heart.
Actually Vegeta did become stronger from Frieza's hits due to his powerlevel gradually increasing after dende healed him, of course saiyan zenkai didnt increase so much from one battle that he could easily defeat frieza, it doesnt work that way
#17 Jul 31 2010, 4:48 pm
If anyone have has anymore more defense on how standing in one spot while punching in mid-air makes sense in a dbz game, feel free to speak up
#18 Jul 31 2010, 5:17 pm
Coolman1250 wrote:
PerfectGoku wrote:
Coolman1250 wrote:
Jedioh wrote:
As far as I remember in the DB series related to training, different people trained you in order to become stronger. The difference between the training in DB series and the games is what (I think) perfectgoku pointed out was that you didn't stand in one spot and hit thin air. You actually had to do something to get stronger, but then again this is fan-based games. What can you honestly expect from a person who wanted something simple and not complex? I'm sure the person who these sources came from didn't want to spend hours on in perfecting the training systems to make sure it's similiar to the show or he probably thought that if he tried to get it right, it would take hours of trial and errors to get it right and if I were that person I would say, "Oh lets just make something simple like sitting thin air to get "strong"

Out of lazyiness I believe this is why people want a simple function to like what Maggeh had already stated, get instant gratification of being "strong"

I stir clear of these types of games. I rather grind with a party than spend half a day self-training because I'm doing SOMETHING, I'm in involved with the game and I'm having fun. I like games where you can make your character grow over time, not get every ability in a split second.

thats not what I meant though, I meant there are more ways to train, such as sparring in general, saiyans get strong for everytime the get hit or get hit by a powerful enemy
---
No they don't, they get thrilled by the experience. Eventually their energy will wear down, by your logic with every punch they'd become nearly invincible. That can easily be disproved throughout the series.
Example: Frieza beats Vegeta to near death. He never got stronger from Frieza's hits, they fatigued him as they should. Eventually he was thrown to the the ground and he couldn't move.
Frieza finishes him off after Son Goku arrives with a death beam to the heart.
Actually Vegeta did become stronger from Frieza's hits due to his powerlevel gradually increasing after dende healed him, of course saiyan zenkai didnt increase so much from one battle that he could easily defeat frieza, it doesnt work that way
---
I was obviously referring to Frieza's fully transformed state, who using one percent of his initial power. Power level is a numerical reading for one's overall ki or chi. Had Vegeta recovered from his fatal wound that Frieza inflicted, a zenkai boost would have taken place. Every hit that Frieza inflicted did not make Vegeta stronger, hence the "blood", "broken armor", "screaming", "not being able to fight back", "barley being able to move".
By your logic, Vegeta should just pound his face into the ground over and over.
#19 Aug 1 2010, 9:00 am
I never liked games where you have to train much, hence NFF the way it is.

But at the same time, you should have something in progress. I always felt training should be based on the actual user's gameplay.

Like, this is a stupid idea, but instead of having to punch this punching bag maybe over 1000 times(which you can still be able to do with hopefully a mini-game attached), maybe instead you have to enter a certain amount of fights that gather EXP at a time.

I dunno, Training is something that makes games unfun and tedious. If you find a way through that, to make it fun(not just fun but easily able to concentrate on so you can spend time doing it for hours and be content)...Otherwise, dreaded training verb strikes back. =/
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