Allow AFK Training? in Design Philosophy

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ID:320846
 
Feb 20 2012, 7:52 pm
Their alot of good and bad from AFK training. What do you think about it and should it be allowed?

This is what I think about AFK training.

Its good because you don't have to hold a button for hours to just train even when talking to others.

It allows players to do other things in life while still in game thus more players = popular game.

It helps players level up faster and enjoy the benefits of having nice stats and pvp or pve.

Anyone can play the game while doing homework or housework. I repeat Anyone.

AFK training should be allowed ONLY RISK are Game disconnecting or getting killed.

_________________________________________________

Bleach Unlimited

and

Naruto Final Fight

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Do not allow AFK Training and will Ban or Erase your character without warning.

Pretty cruel huh?

Rules against AFK Training is useless man.

Should Allow AFK Training.

Let us enjoy it and stop being so serious and banning for something like that.

Anyone can do this just use macro and hold it while watching movie on your laptop or even put something on the key so you can do stuff around house.

No this is not unfair its unfair that some people are glued to the game and don't do other things ^^
#1 Feb 20 2012, 8:01 pm
If you're playing games that require you to hold down a button for hours on end, you should probably re-assess your life and figure out where you went wrong.
#2 Feb 20 2012, 8:12 pm
In response to Robertbanks2 (#1)
Robertbanks2 wrote:
If you're playing games that require you to hold down a button for hours on end, you should probably re-assess your life and figure out where you went wrong.

Its sad... but true! *-*

Hehe I mostly AFK Trained because I just love games~ Doing homework and looking for a job. College is a pain.

#3 Feb 20 2012, 8:31 pm
I think AFK training is great for those who have a life.

If you think it would fit in with the games style/game play then add it.
#4 Feb 20 2012, 11:30 pm
Lige wrote:
I wouldn't go out of my way to add in an "AFK training" command, but if the player can find a way to AFK train then they shouldn't be punished for my faults as the developer.

I already made a rage post on my personal off-BYOND blog about this so now I feel I can be nicer on the subject. I agree and disagree with this at the same time.


Yes: If exploits get found for them to do so you admit your fault for allowing it; and reprimand your mistake as soon as you can.

No: They can still be “Punished” if you clearly tell them not to do something and they do it anyways. That’s just clear insubordination. Tell them to deal with it? They forget the game isn't a democracy it's your way or the disconnected way. Yes that seems rather mean but it gets through to the BYOND community these days.


And I am sorry, DeathbyKiss. But if you're in college working on your coarse work, and on-top of that trying to get a job? Then why are you caring so much about a game you're actually doing nothing in by AFK Training? A character who isn't really "Special" considering others can do it too?

I'm sorry but I find it hard to really sympathize too much here.

#5 Feb 21 2012, 6:56 am
If your players don't even have to be at the controls to play your game you have failed as a game designer.
#6 Feb 21 2012, 7:33 am (Edited on Feb 21 2012, 7:39 am)
I enjoy playing games and with all this busy stuff going on it would really help. Is their anything wrong using my laptop to train in a game while away? And able to get on it when I am finished? I did it with other MMORPG's that actually had a AFK system. Oh god it was perfect for us with busy schedule! I did work before it was temp.

Worked 6 Days A week 11+ Hours 20$ Hourly. Made 800-1,200 A week. During the summer.

It not cause of money, its the right thing to do. College though heh...

I just love games played it when I was little so hard to just stop. I like going out instead of just playing a game all day ^^

AFK Training would be great for us folks with busy life.

Not saying it should be allowed without risks.

If a Game Developer made a game with AFK System (It exist) He fails? You miss the Main Point. Let me ask you something.

AFK Training Allowed = More People. Less Bans

AFK Training Not Allowed = Less-Decent People. More Bans

Of course the style of the game and gameplay would effect this. Excluding the people who do play all day...

Let them AFK Train! Their in your game so they must like it alot if they want to get better and (If they know) risk getting banned. Geez guys the more you ban the less players will join.

Stop being selfish it would help Byond as well and get more players I bet we lost 50%+ of byond players because this strict rule of AKF Training. We are still here and waiting for that perfect game on Byond. Don't get me wrong their already some nice games with great staff who don't ban unless its really needed. They are a smart Staff ^^
#7 Feb 21 2012, 11:54 am
I don't think it's right to consider it "playing" when you're not actually there, and it isn't right to consider people "players" if they're not actually "playing."

Although it might look like your game has a lot of "players online", you still don't have anyone playing your game, and that's a catastrophic design failure.
#8 Feb 21 2012, 12:26 pm
To be honest, if you have some sort of combat game and it's done correctly it shouldn't be possible for players to AFK train. By that I mean you shouldn't use the infamous log training that BYOND is all-too well known for.

I'd suggest making the player have to fight actual NPCs or players to gain experience.
#9 Feb 21 2012, 12:56 pm
Why have training in the first place? If you don't want to actually have to train, then eliminate leveling altogether and make a game like Proelium where there are just a bunch of classes that are all balanced.

It's kind of silly to say "I'm too busy to train, so I'll just make an AFK button" when you could simply remove leveling in the first place and not have to deal with it at all.
#10 Feb 21 2012, 1:07 pm
In response to Robertbanks2 (#1)
Robertbanks2 wrote:
If you're playing games that require you to hold down a button for hours on end, you should probably re-assess your life and figure out where you went wrong.

Runescape comes to mind
#11 Feb 21 2012, 1:21 pm
You guys seem to forget EVE online. you could "train" your character by not even being online,but it really doesn't help you progress through the game.
#12 Feb 21 2012, 1:26 pm
AFK Train = Ban Hammer.

Enough said.

Theres no reason to play the game if you ease right through it.
#13 Feb 21 2012, 2:08 pm
In response to OrangeWeapons (#10)
OrangeWeapons wrote:
Runescape comes to mind

Hehe. I used to play that so much, and now whenever I log into it, I think to myself "How was I once able to tolerate this BS?"
#14 Feb 21 2012, 7:42 pm
I must agree with the general consensus. Games are designed to be played by players actively. If you're wanting a passive gaming experience, go make another Farmville-esque project. When I play an RPG, I play it because there's generally a story to tell and progress to be made.

I think the reasoning that AFK Training is "Fun" to some people is that it's easy. You input little effort for instant gratification. Isn't that what most of these kiddies want out of their games? Instant Gratification? These players are the types who judge games based on how quickly you can get to X power level. When there's any real effort involved in progression, or an actual change in the method used to progress, these kids toss down the game huffing, "This game is too hard, this sucks!" and walk off.

If you're all about feeding these "Power Kiddies" as I like to refer to them, then that's certainly your prerogative. However if you feel the need to have a competent and semi-intelligent fan-base, then I suggest you wrap up those training verbs in their respective boxes and store them back in the attic to collect more dust until another venturous young soul stumbles upon them once more.
#15 Feb 21 2012, 9:00 pm (Edited on Feb 21 2012, 9:06 pm)
In response to Solomn Architect (#14)
Solomn Architect wrote:
I must agree with the general consensus. Games are designed to be played by players actively. If you're wanting a passive gaming experience, go make another Farmville-esque project. When I play an RPG, I play it because there's generally a story to tell and progress to be made.

I think the reasoning that AFK Training is "Fun" to some people is that it's easy. You input little effort for instant gratification. Isn't that what most of these kiddies want out of their games? Instant Gratification? These players are the types who judge games based on how quickly you can get to X power level. When there's any real effort involved in progression, or an actual change in the method used to progress, these kids toss down the game huffing, "This game is too hard, this sucks!" and walk off.

If you're all about feeding these "Power Kiddies" as I like to refer to them, then that's certainly your prerogative. However if you feel the need to have a competent and semi-intelligent fan-base, then I suggest you wrap up those training verbs in their respective boxes and store them back in the attic to collect more dust until another venturous young soul stumbles upon them once more.

You made me laugh! :D

I understand what you are saying its just only able to play 30 Minutes up to an Hour comparing those "Power Kiddies" who I bet stay up all day and night training. Ughh... It would be good for both of us. We can play longer and they can actually study and do better at school.

But of course its not 100% AFK Training more like 75-90% of it for most but depends on their situation. Keep in mind Members range from Age 1-199. You be surprise what kids would do to keep playing. Ex: Skipping School, Staying up all night (No Sleep), Pretending Sickness. This is not healthy for crying out loud I use to be like that with Runescape... I quit for my own good of course.
#16 Feb 21 2012, 9:10 pm
In response to EmpirezTeam (#9)
EmpirezTeam wrote:
Why have training in the first place? If you don't want to actually have to train, then eliminate leveling altogether and make a game like Proelium where there are just a bunch of classes that are all balanced.

It's kind of silly to say "I'm too busy to train, so I'll just make an AFK button" when you could simply remove leveling in the first place and not have to deal with it at all.

Good idea and also made me think of something else. Make it so its impossible to AFK Train most common is using macro right? If someone uses macro make it so it won't allow it Ex: Cooldown : 1 Sec+

I remember back in the old days just macro to train was never too serious about AFK Training. I wonder how and why they actually started making it a rule? Hmm.
#17 Feb 21 2012, 11:49 pm
In response to DeathbyKiss (#15)
I understand what you are saying its just only able to play 30 Minutes up to an Hour comparing those "Power Kiddies" who I bet stay up all day and night training. Ughh... It would be good for both of us. We can play longer and they can actually study and do better at school.

I work 36 hours a week and come home too tired to open Dream Seeker let alone Dream Maker. I can still find the time to play games and watch anime if I really want to. I get seven hours between finishing work and going to bed. There's a lot of time in that for playing games and watching tele. If I had the energy, making games would also be possible.

But of course its not 100% AFK Training more like 75-90% of it for most but depends on their situation. Keep in mind Members range from Age 1-199. You be surprise what kids would do to keep playing. Ex: Skipping School, Staying up all night (No Sleep), Pretending Sickness. This is not healthy for crying out loud I use to be like that with Runescape... I quit for my own good of course.

That's a problem for their parents, not the game developer. Parents are getting pretty lazy this day and age. Expecting the government and whatnot to raise their kids. This kind of attitude allows internet censorship and whatnot because "the kids might see something they're not supposed to" or "the kids are in danger from people who will try to stalk them". It just doesn't fly I'm afraid. Parents job to raise their kids, not the school, not the government and especially not a game developer.

--

The game should never have a mechanic where this is possible. At the very least, they should have to write some kind of bot to simulate the playing of the game. Back in DBO I used to put a sinker on a macro'd F2 and go to school. I learned this was a poor way to play a game.

Grinding is pretty boring, but it's more interesting than slaughtering the all mighty "p-bag".

Honestly, I'm trying to come up with an interesting way to level a character that isn't the same old "Go to [A], collect [B], go to [C], do [something], go to [A] and collect reward" style quests. They are so boring at my age. As is grinding.

I liked Borderlands approach with FPS, but the RPG aspect was left hanging. And it suffered from the same problem all games suffer from. It got repetitive and boring. Which is essentially every mechanic that can incorporate any kind of "AFK Training".

Unless you want your target audience to be kids willing to skip school to play your game. Then I suppose, go ahead, it's your net dream. You'll have a player count, but not many actual players. Definitely not a good profit margin either.
#18 Feb 22 2012, 4:13 am
From my point of view AFK Training isn't bad...
Creating verbs which give you the option of AFK Training IS Bad.

I mean, self train, all those WEIRD Verbs or even Punch Str-Log, etc, etc! It's just stupid.

In GREAT Games, you can earn level through missions, through killing enemies, seeing stronger people, etc... I mean, getting stronger shouldn't be something you really need in a game to have fun, I once created a Pokemon Game and you basically leveled through missions + killing enemies, that motivated the player to play because he could explore new places, and have fun with friends. In DBZ Rips or some Anime Games where you just press Self Train and you wait until you're level 197547+e089 you barely focus on exploring the game, just focus on getting strong and getting skills (you normally get them by the same button, you don't even need to search for a npc or do a mission!), and then you can troll around killing every newbie unless they have safe zones and you'll be leaving the game in like 1 min.

I've never seen self train command or something like that in an original game, that's how they attract people. Why spend 10000 years on a weird place pressing a macro (or even using a program to spam it) when you can join a game which makes you stronger through the knowledge you have of it? I don't know how to explain it, w.e.

The thing is -> Games with Self Train / Punch Log / Train Pokemon are HORRIBLE.
#19 Feb 22 2012, 1:22 pm
In response to DeathbyKiss (#15)
DeathbyKiss wrote:
I understand what you are saying its just only able to play 30 Minutes up to an Hour comparing those "Power Kiddies" who I bet stay up all day and night training. Ughh... It would be good for both of us. We can play longer and they can actually study and do better at school.

The issue with AFK training isn't a time based one. It's the fact that it's just so lazy. Awesome progression isn't a matter of time it takes to level up. Anyone can create an amazing game with great progression but only takes, say 3 hours of play time to get to the level cap. The thing to remember is that progression needn't be slow, in fact, the faster it is, again, the more fun it can be to quickly learn about new powers and whatnot. The hard part comes in the presentation. When training becomes nothing more than pushing a single button or standing in one spot for an hour, it becomes dull and more like a chore than a game. However if you add fun quests that take you deep into treasure rich dungeons fulled with epic boss monsters to battle, then you have a game that, no matter how easy it is to level in, is very fun for players and will keep them coming back for more. Awesome fights, some end-game content, an interesting story, and a dash of skill is most of what it takes to make a fun and progressive game.
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