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Pay your Developers better!
Mar 21 2010, 7:57 pm
I understand, realisticly I wouldn't pay that much for someone to program a BYOND game, but come on, a little more than $80!
Realistically, if they wanted me to program a whole game I'd probably say more around $200
Mar 21 2010, 8:17 pm
Flame Sage, you'd be lucky if you could pay someone to write code for their game.
Mar 21 2010, 8:58 pm
Whoah, where'd all the hate come from?
Mar 22 2010, 4:14 am
$50.00 for two months work? That's about enough to motivate me to scratch my ass while I'm in bed. Not nearly enough to get me out of bed, let alone to my computer.
Then again, a lot of the people around here are kids. And I'd bet $50.00 is a lot of money to them. Hell, up until recently, it was a lot of money to me. But I still wouldn't do two months work for it. A week more like it.
Also, this payment once it's finished thing, I don't trust that at all.
Mar 22 2010, 5:38 am (Edited on Mar 22 2010, 5:45 am)
The Magic Man wrote:
I was simply correcting him.
Since when was the average programmer salary lower than the average graphics designer/maker or whatever you wish to call them?
Artists get around $40,000 to $80,000 (USD).
Programmers get around $50,000 to $120,000 (USD).
Video Game Testers get around $15,000 to $40,000 (USD).
It's always been like that.
EDIT: Unless you are talking about 3D Graphics Programmers, but that's still classified as programmer and not artist.
Mar 22 2010, 6:20 am (Edited on Mar 22 2010, 6:26 am)
Zaole already mentioned this, but I'll reiterate:
There is no incentive whatsoever to pay a 14 year old kid without any of the necessary qualifications for a programming job, or even formal training for that matter, anything at all. Treating advertisements with "pay" in here as serious jobs is ridiculous. The pay is intended as little more than a side bonus; programmers are supposed to join projects they would enjoy working on. Anyone looking for serious pay is better off elsewhere.
If you want to make 7K a month, go get an education and apply for work in a serious company. BYOND is a site for amateur game developers, who work for fun, and almost always for free. Far as I know, only two games have ever earned more than 1K$. It would be nice if this changed one day, and BYOND became a platform for more serious and professional game developing, but I can't see this happening in the near future, if ever. Right now, though, it's a for-fun platform for amateur game developers to make their "dream games" without much of the effort required, and should not be (generally) understood to promote any element of professionalism at all.
I would love to be proven wrong, but I doubt someone who isn't completely clueless would challenge this.
Mar 22 2010, 7:36 am
I agree nearly 100% with Toadfish.
With BYOND, you handle things "as-is".
There is no contracts, no hidden fees, nothing. Why? Because the majority of BYOND are minors, which aren't "mature" enough to handle the responsibilities of a contract. You can't hold it in court with a minor over a thing such as designing a game using an engine that is mostly used as fun-time/hobby.
Although, I like the ideal of more serious advertisements, but they need to be treated more appropriately.
Kids can't advertise because kids can't do business.
You'll be lucky enough to make $20 a month on BYOND, let alone $7,000. And most of that $20 is for your name and reputation and not your actual knowledge and experience with DM.
I would love to see BYOND stay as it is, for developing PC based games, but I'd love to also see the engine grow more powerful. (More fps, networking, tools, etc.)
The way I see it, you can take BYOND 2 ways.
The Red Pill - You stay in your seriousness life, thinking BYOND is an essential matter to life, and the drama encountered on BYOND actually means anything. With this, you dwell and strive to design the best of the best games available to the online community that BYOND is, and potentially gather more prey from the non-BYOND world.
The Blue Pill - You enjoy it. Dream it. Live it. Love it. Explore it. Stop stressing over what is and isn't, and start motivating what could be and would be.
Or something like that.
I don't honestly, know. I'm in the library of a college on a small-arse laptop I borrowed and I was passing time and decided to read upon this more.
Mar 22 2010, 7:38 am
Oh trust me, I understand.
If the person has an interest in the project, and is willing to work for free, by all means.
But paying someone a measly $80 to program for two months is crazy.
I would expect no less than $200 - $300 for two months of work. (After drawing out some kind of a plan, how much do you want me to program?)
Mar 22 2010, 2:27 pm
I'm not sure how you decide on these numbers, but we've already established that anything below several thousand a month is far from the rate of a professional programmer. There is very little point working for two months for that amount (be it 80$ or 300$) alone. Again, the pay is meant as a side-bonus and not the main attraction of the "job" (which varies from person to person).
should be employed at a rate much lower than the minimum employment wage in any non-Third-World country (and many Third World countries) is nonsensical. Sure, getting paid 300$ is nicer than getting paid 80$, but this is missing the point: the amount of pay is disproportional to the amount of work you're expected to do, because the guys who posted the ad aren't "employing" you in a professional sense; they're inviting you to work with them, and offer a side-bonus as additional incentive.
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