Pixel Art Payment Information in Art & Sound

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ID:787172
 
May 30 2012, 5:47 pm
Keywords: artist, artwork, byond, pay, pixel
I've always been iffy about hiring a pixel artist from BYOND, due to the fact that BYOND doesn't really have a secure way of being sure you'll receive your art after it's done, and no sure way of know whether or not you'll receive your payment once the art is sent.

So a couple questions arose when I gave it some thought.

1.) Which person/people are the most reliable when it comes to paying for Pixel Artwork?

2.) What are the going rates for icons with about 1-15 states, and each state varying from 1-20 frames.

If I am suppose to post this under: Art & Sounds
I apologize.
#1 May 30 2012, 5:56 pm
1. The only reliable person I've found when it comes to pixel art is UPD4T3. I ended up getting tired of being screwed over by people on BYOND so I started to pixel art for myself. Or you could contact people on larger art-based forums like Pixelation.

2. This varies on the artist and the quality of the work. Reasonably price for quality work at 32x32 with 15 states could vary anywhere from $3.00 to $15.00. It all depends.
#2 May 30 2012, 5:57 pm
Gizhy wrote:
1.) Which person/people are the most reliable when it comes to paying for Pixel Artwork?

Honestly .. I have seen tons of people being ripped off, YOU yourself not Irene, you are the most reliable.

Paying someone else always has a downside ie them leaving, not doing the job etc.

It's a gamble really.
#3 May 30 2012, 6:09 pm
So UPD4T3. Can anyone list some others who are deems reliable when it comes to purchasing Pixel Art?

Around August 2nd, I plan on paying some highly reliable pixel artist(s) for a big project.
#4 May 31 2012, 3:03 am (Edited on May 31 2012, 3:36 am)
I've commissioned art from a few artists, although not all of them used BYOND. None of them are around BYOND now either, but that's no reason not to contact them if you're able to pay a reasonable amount - I would happily recommend all three. If you're still worried about being scammed out of your money, even if the artist has a good reputation, do not send the cash unless you see proof of the art (watermarks work well for this).

Matt Walkden - http://forums.indiegamer.com/ showthread.php?28889-Matthew-Walkden-Pixel-artist-illustrato r

Terry (was known as AmonR on BYOND) - http://www.terrymakesstuff.com/

Tor Crowley (left BYOND) -http://www.byond.com/members/ TorCrowley?command=view_post&post=121421&first_unread=1


These are the only two current BYONDers I know of that freelance and are good at what they do, if you don't want to go outside of BYOND, but I haven't paid them for any art:

http://www.byond.com/members/zete
http://www.byond.com/members/zane444

Your best bet is to look through the classifieds on Pixel Joint: http://www.pixeljoint.com/forum/forum_topics.asp?FID=20


Keep in mind that good art can be costly, depending on the amount of content your game has. If it's a small scale ORPG, for example, it would be difficult to commission enough art without at least a few thousand (and this is on the cheapest rates around). Most freelancers charge anywhere from $10 an hour to $30 an hour. A single 32x32 tile can vary from $2 to $6. This is for high quality art though... someone less experienced may give you a cheaper deal.

I recommend, if you haven't already, to set a budget for your project and write out an asset list - all of the art you'll need to release your game. Price each item based on the number of tiles, on what you think is a fair price. Send this out to freelancers on Pixel Joint and see what they say... I think multiple quotes from experienced artists would definitely be beneficial before you decide how much you're going to pay.

And a tip from personal experience, if the game is an ORPG, do not shelve character outfits/weapons/loot to the end. Unless your base sprite has a limited amount of frames, they are going to be very costly. A single outfit in my RPG can cost $30-60 depending on the artist. This isn't especially great because I focused the budget on monsters and tile art, assuming overlays would be cheaper.

Sorry if your project isn't an ORPG, it's just that "big game" makes me think this.
#5 May 31 2012, 5:54 am
I wonder if we could set up some sort of BYOND-based system for purchasing art, where the funds are held in escrow until the work is complete, similar to how Freelancer.co.uk handles the matter.
#6 May 31 2012, 10:59 am
In response to Writing A New One (#4)
I'd like to thank you firstly for the highly detailed reply.

I've already got a budget set, I am going to be obtaining well over $10,000 on August 2nd, so I am sure payment wouldn't be a problem. As for the Pixel Artists, I would only want the most highly skilled & renown Pixel Artists to work on this game considering the fact that I'm investing money into a Project that "could" be totally free.

The one problem I'm facing is finding a highly skilled Pixel Artist to work on an ORPG game (nice assumption) I'm currently developing. I know I would not be able to handle the stacks of programming required to fill this games quota, so I would also be looking for some renown programmers as well.

But as of now, the game won't be able to continue to be developed until August 2nd when I receive my money to pay the developers willing to support this project with their skilled work.

As of now I'm just getting all the Intel on BYOND & beyond for Pixel Artists, and programmers skilled in the DM language.

Do you have any sources an tips as to where I can find a programmer willing to help with the project, an he/she will be payed of course. The payments and resources needed will all be negotiated at a later time.

In regards to Deathguard's Post:
I honestly was thinking of bringing this to BYOND's attention. I for one think this is an excellent idea. Keep supporting it!
#7 May 31 2012, 11:21 am
Do you have any sources an tips as to where I can find a programmer willing to help with the project.
The payments and resources needed will all be negotiated at a later time.

Your best bet is probably a Classified Ad, but if you don't know what specifically it is you want yet, or what budget you're playing with, it's probably best to wait until you do know.

We get a guy with a cool idea for an ORPG pop up once every week though, so the more technically skilled programmers may be jaded about your project, just something to bear in mind.

That I can think of... SuperAntX, Stephen001, Gughunter, D4RK3 54B3R, Oasiscircle, Unknown Person.
Hiro The Dragon King too, though I'm not sure whether he does commission/hired stuff for other people. Same with DarkCampainger and OneFishDown/Forum_account.

Two pretty (in)famous developers are SilkWizard and Falacy, though the last two might earn your game some enmity just because people don't tend to like them. And I don't think they do commission work, they just work on their own stuff instead.
#8 May 31 2012, 1:22 pm
Well, I can't see either of the last two really making your game for you, as they are game developers in their own right, as opposed to programmers/artists etc.

NEStalgia's success wasn't it's programming, it's the design and concept. (Which isn't to say the programming is bad of course, I wouldn't know)
#9 Jun 1 2012, 11:46 pm (Edited on Jun 1 2012, 11:54 pm)
In response to Gizhy (#6)
Gizhy wrote:
I've already got a budget set, I am going to be obtaining well over $10,000 on August 2nd, so I am sure payment wouldn't be a problem.

That's awesome. I don't see why $10'000 wouldn't cover your project's art... I've spent about $5'000 on Eternia (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0w60kV9ZE6g&feature=relmfu) and all that we're really lacking is extra content, but that shouldn't cost more than another $1000 or so, which I'll be able to pay for in August as well, oddly. I think a budget of $10'000 could only be a problem if your base sprite is bigger than 32x32, increasing the price of other art (turf art would have to be scaled appropriately, monsters, clothing, etc). Regardless, if you write everything out and plan efficiently, it may just fill the quota.

As for the Pixel Artists, I would only want the most highly skilled & renown Pixel Artists to work on this game considering the fact that I'm investing money into a Project that "could" be totally free.

Well, a warning, the most experienced artists are going to be charging no less than $20-30 an hour. They're the guys that have worked in gaming studios and are in high demand. You could hire someone that doesn't have a breadth of experience and still have a fine looking game - even hobbyists have some really nice portfolios.


The one problem I'm facing is finding a highly skilled Pixel Artist to work on an ORPG game (nice assumption) I'm currently developing. I know I would not be able to handle the stacks of programming required to fill this games quota, so I would also be looking for some renown programmers as well.

If you're able to offer a decent price for the commissions, there's no reason you shouldn't be able to find a good artist. Just post an ad on http://pixeljoint.com and you'll have a bunch of offers.

I recommend that you program the game yourself though - in my experience, BYOND is lacking in programmers willing to partner up - even if you're offering money. You should definitely keep it small at first too, before going ahead with larger plans - get the core elements of an ORPG down and a private test server going before you add the other features.

But as of now, the game won't be able to continue to be developed until August 2nd when I receive my money to pay the developers willing to support this project with their skilled work.

Do you have any sources an tips as to where I can find a programmer willing to help with the project, an he/she will be payed of course. The payments and resources needed will all be negotiated at a later time.

If you are set on commissioning a programmer, I recommend SuperAntx and Shadowdarke, two programmers that I've had great experiences with. Both are highly productive, talented, honest, and will help you to release a good game. SuperAntx is active in Chatters and Shadowdarke can be reached via e-mail (shadowdarke@hotmail.com). I know that Shadowdarke is currently working around 50 hours a week so he might not be interested in your project due to time restrictions.

If you want to chat in private about this too, I'd like that. I want to keep an eye on your project: method_acting@live.co.uk
#10 Jun 2 2012, 10:45 am
Thanks for all this information. I will definitely be looking into the http://pixeljoint.com/ website for Pixel Artists, as for the $20-$30 dollars an hour artists, well that would (to me) be a little ridiculous for pixel art, I don't think I need my pixel art that highly detailed, just enough to make sure the art is presentable, maybe around 4 bits.

From my experience, I've always did my pixel art 4 bit style, with a base color, an outline color, and dark/light shading, and my art never looked to bad, it was presentable, but I lack in player bases, I'm more of a turf artist, which is why I'd need to hire someone.

In all honesty, I don't expect to spend $10,000 on this project, but the money is their if I need an extra helping hand after I get a couple artists going on the pixel work.

As for the programming, I was highly considering doing it all myself, but I just don't know how time consuming it'll be (i.e. debugging, etc..), because I'm planning on going to college sometime by the end of this year, an I'm not 100% sure how much time I'll have to work on the game. I know I'll have time to update it, and work on it. But the amount of time to it'll take to polish the game with only me programming is undetermined. I estimate early 2013 to mid 2013 for the game to release to the public.

I currently have no power at my house (will be back on soon) and am using my brothers computer to write this, so I will add you to MSN as soon as I can.

Email Is: davidbobrowski@live.com
#11 Nov 15 2012, 2:30 pm
In response to Stephen001 (#8)
Decent administration is also what made many of the older games from 2003, 2007 and 2009 so popular. When you needed help with the game, an Admin, GM or Moderator wasn't far from view. When there were conflicts between players, they would mediate, or just leave the people to fight it out amongst themselves (we even sometimes had Arenas for this lol).

Anymore, only a few of our most promoted games on BYOND are carefully and effectively moderated/administrated. However good/bad the icons were, however good/bad the coding was, a healthy sense of community often did even the most horribly put-together games good.

So, imagine if the better promoted games (such as the ones we often see on the BYOND Games page) had warm, courteous and professional Customer Service team?

I've been coding, designing and doing icons on BYOND for 10 years, so I'm "in the know" ;)
#12 Nov 15 2012, 3:14 pm
I may be able to offer services if you're okay with wire transfers(I cannot use paypal apparently)
#13 Nov 15 2012, 3:15 pm
In response to Maximillion VonMitternacht (#11)
Reveal yourself! because you Joined:Oct 29
#14 Nov 15 2012, 3:50 pm
In response to Zane444 (#12)
Zane444 wrote:
I may be able to offer services if you're okay with wire transfers(I cannot use paypal apparently)

Stick to SA, stop trying to get money, you greedy child.
#15 Nov 15 2012, 9:19 pm
id say A2J2TIWARI is actually reliable and trusted.

i can program and pixel art if u need help as well.
#16 Nov 16 2012, 4:22 am
On BYOND, people actually worth money would be...
(This is past and present, as I am unaware of who's still lurking)

- Tor (MIA)
- Zane444
- Pmitch (MIA)
- AmonR (MIA)
- HuiloG (MIA)
- UPDT
- Mes
- Zete (MIA)
- Pandora's Secret

Those with(MIA)next to their names are likely to have left, or are currently busy. I am also an pixel artist, but I am currently tied to a project :3

You can easily find a 'iconner' on BYOND, but there are very few pixel artists, and by iconner I mean the generic level of slob some people make, if someone puts time and effort into their work, then its art, otherwise its simply them being lazy.

@ Deathguard
That would actually be a perfect idea lol, most artists dislike doing paid work on BYOND, as its very easy for some to just run out on you. People could simply set up commissions, and work out the price of a set amount of work, once the work is completed, BYOND could be middle man of sorts, but then again sometimes people want edits on work produced, so that would be a factor that would need to be taken into account.
#17 Nov 19 2012, 7:18 pm
I would vouch for HulioG. He did a bunch of freelance stuff for me on a project that never came to fruition (I abandoned it due to work obligations). His work was consistently good and his turnaround was quick. Criticism was listened to and he made changes and updates as requested. I would definitely recommend him.
#18 Nov 20 2012, 9:28 am
I wouldn't recommend Tor, he's* currently very busy, unreliable( working on 3 weeks commision for 6 months), and overly uninterested in the level of this comminitiy's lesser quality needs, not that he can handle proffesional grade art himself...
#19 Nov 25 2012, 9:57 am
Idk about any good pixel artists on byond persay. I've met a few, but most of them seem to be jaded by past experiences or only willing to work for friends or acquaintances- or anime games that seem cool- regardless of if you are paying them or not.

As far as not getting burned, use Paypal.
if you send the payment first and they take your money, file a dispute. It will freeze their account and yours until the dispute is resolved. Problematic in a few ways, but also effective.

Also never send money as a gift, and personally I would do half first half later for first time work buddies.

Typically tho you can weed out the pixel artists who don't intend to actually work by asking for a reference. Most of them won't respond if they had no real intention to work.
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