ID:133528
 
I've been looking for a terms of service page and haven't been able to find one. At this point, i'm guessing there isn't.

Due to the way the new site feels and looks, a person could pretty much do anything and not be in violation of BYOND's rules... because well... there are none at a first glance.

I'd like to see a set of rules and a link to such on the bottom of the page. The reason for this is because too many fanbased games are now generating money, and the staff isn't prompt enough in dealing with it.

If it's funding that's a problem, i'd like to help lift some pressure, even if only a little, but I don't want to also feel like i'm wasting my money.

BYOND is a great program, the community is entertaining, but the amount of illegal actions here is insane.

Thank you.
Stevenw9 wrote:
I've been looking for a terms of service page and haven't been able to find one. At this point, i'm guessing there isn't.

There's a ToS page for when you purchase BYOND membership, but it'd be nice to make that more readily accessible. Noted.

Due to the way the new site feels and looks, a person could pretty much do anything and not be in violation of BYOND's rules... because well... there are none at a first glance.

The fact that rules aren't conspicuous doesn't mean they don't exist. You yourself went looking for a rules page because you surmised correctly that all sites have rules; they may not however be explicitly spelled out.

I'd like to see a set of rules and a link to such on the bottom of the page. The reason for this is because too many fanbased games are now generating money, and the staff isn't prompt enough in dealing with it.

This is largely an area that the staff can't police. Your expectations are unrealistic.

Lummox JR
In response to Lummox JR (#1)
I am guessing you are saying this because of the lack of staff, and the lack of funds to support a larger staff?
In response to Stevenw9 (#2)
That would probably be correct, but the more prominent factor would be the sheer amount of fangames, not the lack of staff. Even tripling the current amount of staff members would not be sufficient.

You wrote:
BYOND is a great program, the community is entertaining, but the amount of illegal actions here is insane.

Bear in mind it is not supported by BYOND, however, and the staff does halt illegal actions that are brought to their attention. The problem is that actively seeking them out themselves would take way too much precious time better used elsewhere.
In response to Kaioken (#3)
I can understand that. I had reported a game with illegal activity over 72 hours ago through a customer support ticket thingy.

I'm hoping something is done about it ;-;

Anyway, yeah, i'd like to see the ToS more readily available. That would satisfy me.
In response to Kaioken (#3)
Not accusing anyone, but what Falacy does on his games is illegal too ?

He collects money on his fan games.
In response to Andre-g1 (#5)
Any kind of unauthorized (by the copyright holder) profit from fan games is illegal. If you've found games that break the law, you should report them (with more specific detail) to the BYOND staff by the contact form, and they will do something about it, probably nuking the offending hub entries.
In response to Kaioken (#6)
I wonder why no one ever reported Falacy ?

He has that subscription crap for like over 2 years.
In response to Andre-g1 (#7)
Maybe he has legal permission to charge for subscriptions?
In response to Miran94 (#8)
Not if he bought the rights to do so from the makers of Bleach and Dragon ball Z.
In response to Andre-g1 (#7)
Falacy doesn't collect money for an individual game, he provides benefits in multiple projects using an umbrella subscription. You never actually actively donate or subscribe to a specific game.
In response to Nadrew (#10)
Most are fan games though, so I still think that shouldn't be allowed.
In response to Andre-g1 (#11)
Strai really only has 3 fan game; Dbz:HU, Bleach Eternity 2 and DuelZ. That's only 3 out of 8 games (I believe) he has on BYOND. I don't particularly see the problem. His subscriptions have been ranted about time and time again, and I just don't get it anymore. If you don't like his charging of Subscription, then just don't play his games. I'm not saying you are, or that you even like his games or Falacy himself. As long as you aren't affected by it, why does it bother you so much? I don't really see how it affects anyone who doesn't play his games, either. If I am wrong there, feel free to correct me, as I have only been on BYOND for about 1 year and 6 months now, so I don't know everything which has occurred. It just seems to me that Falacy seems to end up in a lot of rants, and I don't get why. I talk to the dude everyday via MSN, and he's a pretty cool guy. Albeit, again, I don't know about things which happened before I joined. Anyway, that's just my two cents, =/.
In response to Monkeyness (#12)
Monkeyness wrote:
His subscriptions have been ranted about time and time again, and I just don't get it anymore. If you don't like his charging of Subscription, then just don't play his games.

Read the topic: it has nothing to do with not liking his subscription. It has to do with the fact profiting from unofficial fan games is an illegal act.
In response to Nadrew (#10)
This seems like you're letting that past fairly too easily, though. Now couldn't everyone simply go make some quick original game and include it in a subscription that includes fan games to have that allowed? Besides, the essence of a fan game being included in a subscription means people are paying for subscribing for the fan game, regardless if they did that for another game or not, and in any case the author is profiting at least partly thanks to the fact he has a fan game, which should still break the law; I doubt it is so easily abused in that if you charge for a 'package' instead, then that law is magically bypassed because you're paying for multiple things instead of one.
I could be wrong, but if so, this seems to be a too-easily abused loophole. :O
In response to Kaioken (#13)
Read the topic: it has nothing to do with not liking his subscription. It has to do with the fact profiting from unofficial fan games is an illegal act.

Yes, but you aren't paying him money for services in his games, it's to join "Stray Games," in total. The bonuses in the game are just an added, thank you, I suppose you could put it. I don't quite see how that is illegal O.o. Also, Falacy doesn't advertise Subscription in his games nor on his BYOND hubs, it's just on his "Stray Games" website. I don't see how you would have much of a case here, but I'm no lawyer, and perhaps you are more law savvy than I. I could be going about this wrong too, so if I am, please inform me.
In response to Monkeyness (#15)
Monkeyness wrote:
Also, Falacy doesn't advertise Subscription in his games nor on his BYOND hubs, it's just on his "Stray Games" website. I don't see how you would have much of a case here, but I'm no lawyer, and perhaps you are more law savvy than I. I could be going about this wrong too, so if I am, please inform me.


Then explain why when you login on DBZ: HU for example, you get like this:

mob/Login()
src << "<font size=1973213892> You are not subscribed to strai games, *link* Subscribe now !"


Then we have a Subscribe button on the map that almost takes up the whole view, you told me to correct you and I did.
In response to Monkeyness (#15)
Monkeyness wrote:
The bonuses in the game are just an added, thank you, I suppose you could put it. I don't quite see how that is illegal O.o.

That logic is off: if you give someone money, and get something in return, you're paying for it, and there is no point in claiming otherwise. The bonuses in these games are consistently given in return for money, and are therefore sold. You don't go in court and claim you weren't dealing drugs because the guy was simply donating to you for free and you gave him the crack in return as a thanks, and stuff for that extent.
I don't see how paying for Stray Games would be somehow legal, either. The only difference is that instead for paying for the fan game only, you are paying for other games together, as well. Wouldn't that mean the fan game IS still being sold regardless?
In response to Andre-g1 (#16)
Andre-g1 wrote:
Monkeyness wrote:
Also, Falacy doesn't advertise Subscription in his games nor on his BYOND hubs, it's just on his "Stray Games" website. I don't see how you would have much of a case here, but I'm no lawyer, and perhaps you are more law savvy than I. I could be going about this wrong too, so if I am, please inform me.


Then explain why when you login on DBZ: HU for example, you get like this:

> mob/Login()
> src << "<font size=1973213892> You are not subscribed to strai games, *link* Subscribe now !"
>


Then we have a Subscribe button on the map that almost takes up the whole view, you told me to correct you and I did.

Oh, sorry, I had completely forgotten about those. Just to tell you though, the subscribe button isn't that big. Yes, it is there, just it's not as big as you say. Sorry for my mistake =/. I get the same message on non-subscribed keys too, just no link telling you to subscribe.
In response to Kaioken (#13)
Kaioken wrote:
Read the topic: it has nothing to do with not liking his subscription. It has to do with the fact profiting from unofficial fan games is an illegal act.

Yeah... but I happen to agree with him: why is everybody ranting about others charging some pocket money from subscriptions on fan games? The only ones that should really be in any position to complain about it are the current copyright holders -- if they don't care, I guess it must be okay to them.

Now I'm not condoning what he did here -- I wouldn't join or even assist a fan game that has a desire for money -- but constantly complaining about it because it's "illegal" won't change a thing about this. If anything a moderator might suspend his hub entries or punish the offender, but the instant that happens they're just going to be pushed to punish all of the offenders on BYOND.

What must it be? Must Lummox JR -- the only full-time employee right now -- work on the software and website, or must he act as a nanny and ban anybody who is charging for fan games, or 'hacks' into other people's keys, or is a member of the BYOND Anime guild?
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