Havin a little rant to make me feel better

ID:278023
 
Dec 23 2008, 2:59 pm
i go onto developer how-to to post my little problems.. and whenever i do i always ave a look to see what everyone else is doing... ya know.. to see if i can help.... well i come across a post about some guy having a bit of trouble with random picking and placing stuff.. this topic can be found here :http://www.byond.com/developer/forum/?id=679137

so i post my little code that i believe can help him.. ill post the code at the bottom in case u guys wanna compare mine to his...

now what gets me annoyed and the reason im ranting is because this guy replies(someone new not the person who posted the topic) that i shouldn't try to help ppl until i learn more about the programming.. because the code i posted was bad.. really bad... i dunno this coz its the way i always solve my coding problems.. i jus fix it little by litle.. nyway, he goes on to say tht my code is bad and tht its not being done properly... but my code solved every problem tht guy put forward (although anyone whos seen the post can agree he is a little vague about what he wants specifically), that aside my code fixed his problems (as best i understood them) and worked perfectly... the only issue the other guy had was tht my code wasnt "done properly", whatever tht actually means.

i then says to him, that i cna see his point of view about people not wanting "bad codes" posted around the forums coz it makes the people who do it "properly" upset, and yea i can totally agree with tht, so i ask him to make post his proper"version of the coding onto the post and ill delete my "bad codes".. Well, i see his post, and it can still be found there as far as im aware, and i couldnt understand half of whats going on because i aint a proper prgrammer.. i dunno how to use args and list lengths etc... even his notation isnt particularly hlpful in what is actually going on.. also one issue springs to mind... the guy asking for help wanted it so that there could not be any duplicated results... his coding was that there are 2 lists, u pick a andom thing from each list, combine them then assign it to a mob.. and he didn want any duplications... so my code (as you can see) will not allow the duplication to be selected, the other guys tho , the "proper" codes, only stop a duplication in the list.. it doesnt stop a duplication from hapening, so although the list wont say "1","2","2","3", 2 people can actually have 2 as a variable.. which is what the guy didnt want... so thts why im ranting and i jus want sum feedback from coders out there.. if u were new (as i assume the guy asking for help is a little bit) would you prefer the code submitted on the topic or my code submitted below...

B.T.W this is just a rant, i dont want anybody making a huge dela out of this its more jus me wanting to get it off my chest rather than nything be done.. but feel free to reply anyway xD

heres the code:
var/list/Combos = list() //the list of combinations
var/list/Partone = list("hi","hello","whatever") //list 1
var/list/Parttwo = list("bob","jim","guy") // list 2


mob
    var
        selection = "" // what has been selected for them
    verb
        Combine()
            usr.Combineproc() // the proc (always good to have procs.. just incase)
            usr.verbs -= /mob/verb/Combine //remove the verb so we know its worked
            
    proc
        Combineproc() // the proc
            var/A
            A=pick(Partone) //random from list 1
            var/B
            B=pick(Parttwo) // random from list 2
            usr.selection = "[A] [B]" // there selection is A and B
            if(usr.selection in Combos) // if selection already exists
                usr.Combineproc() // rerun the proc.. no duplicates!!
            else // if not a duplicate
                Combos += usr.selection // add it to the list
                return
    verb
        Stalk() // the stalking bit u mentioned (again a verb and a proc)
            var/K //why K.. i have no idea
            K=input("Which combination will u stalk?","")in Combos  // select a made combination from combos
            for(var/mob/M in world) // check every mob
                if(M.selection==K) // if there selection is what you chose
                    M << "Someone is stalking you" // theres ya 
                else //if not
                    return // return to whatever
    Stat() //jus sum stats too see if everything is working
        statpanel("Your Selection") //jus to see what our selection is
        stat("[usr.selection]","")
        statpanel("All combinations") // all combos created so far
        stat(Combos)
Dec 23 2008, 3:06 pm
Also if anyone can help me out id much appreciate it.. chekc this for meh http://www.byond.com/developer/forum/?id=679098

much appreciated
Dec 23 2008, 3:25 pm
Yeah, you shouldn't be helping people. No need to rant, just spend your time learning how to program instead of teaching others what you don't know. People might take you more seriously if you weren't too lazy to type, too.
Dec 23 2008, 4:07 pm
Heres the thing about code snippets in general:

You may have the best intentions in mind when you stumble upon a thread and want to help. But perhaps you're not at a point where you understand enough about programming and the language to do so, keeping in mind how to best help the person at hand.

While I haven't read the thread in question (so I'm unaware of the specifics), I can say this: We get lots of people trying to help who post a snippet that might work for a specific situation, but would break under many circumstances. Or a snippet that promotes doing things in a horrible fashion. This is actually going to hurt things for the person requesting help, even if the person might not be aware of that.

I applaud the fact that you took the time to consider that if an alternative were posted that served the purpose better you'd pull your post. Which is more than many others do, who simply get insulted and leave. You have to remember that someone making you aware of the fact that a snippet you post isn't very good is not an attack on you. It simply means that you might not be good enough to be teaching.

So cheer up and take it for what it is ;) The helpful nature of many BYONDers is one of the boons of this community - Just remember to figure out when you're helping and when you aren't.
Dec 24 2008, 3:54 am
In response to Alathon
yea i guess ur right... ill stick ith my way for now tho.. im used to using it and it works or me... i jus wont help unless im sure i know that it is helping
Dec 24 2008, 4:04 am
In response to Alathon
Your right Alathon, but I think the biggest problem here, is when people do try and correct someone about their scripting, they tend to be rude about it and thats how it can feel to people as well. When all they could have said was, well, your way is OK, but there is much better way to do it, and this is how.. Theres a superiority complex going around on BYOND and when someone thinks they are better then you, most people won't waste any time trying to rub it in your face. I've come across it several times myself, and when someone is rude, and it feels like an attack, most people won't want to listen.
Dec 24 2008, 5:21 am
In response to Alathon
Alathon wrote:
You may have the best intentions in mind when you stumble upon a thread and want to help. But perhaps you're not at a point where you understand enough about programming and the language to do so, keeping in mind how to best help the person at hand.

(..) post a snippet that might work for a specific situation, but would break under many circumstances. Or a snippet that promotes doing things in a horrible fashion. This is actually going to hurt things for the person requesting help, even if the person might not be aware of that.

(...) It simply means that you might not be good enough to be teaching.

(...)- Just remember to figure out when you're helping and when you aren't.

Actually, I'm torn, so I'd like to discuss with you, if you don't mind.

BYOND serves a specific kind of customer (speaking of the average), which means that special characteristics have to be considered.

The average BYOND customer is not proficient when it comes to the basic (abstract) theories of object oriented programming, yet she is trying to start creating a project right away.

Now, the problem would be that, even with commented code, the person seeking help is likely to miss a learning effect when the code snippet provided touches issues that have not yet crossed her mind.

You might have to decide between teaching non perfect programming habits, or not teaching at all, which would suggest the usage of code the poster might be able to follow, to achieve a slow progress/understanding.

Like I said, I'm torn.
Both methods have advantages and disadvantages.

I am aware that I, by no means, am capable of delivering good code snippets and thus would not even try (though I have a basic idea of what I'm doing).
That is why I try to avoid posting code and instead hint to the section of the reference that I think would prove beneficial for the person in need.
That way, I hope to lead to the solution, with a learning effect involved, as I explain more and more each time the person asks, yet allowing her to do the main work herself.

I'd like constructive input, since I'm unsure myself and haven't yet completely made up my mind.
Best with valid statistics, if someone bothered with such things.
Dec 24 2008, 9:47 am
In response to Trosh Kubyo
I agree with you. It seems like Popisfizzy and Kaioken and perhaps a few others are trying to be too much like Garthor, and that's not good for anybody. At least Garthor used to have a sort of net positive. While they're all skilled, they're all complete <expletives> if you know what I mean.

The solution the OP posted was not necessarily the best way to go about it, but it certainly wasn't the worst, either. To step in and simply say "Your code is bad so stop helping" doesn't work. It's rude and not helpful to anybody.
Dec 24 2008, 10:18 am
In response to Alathon
Alathon wrote:
You may have the best intentions in mind when you stumble upon a thread and want to help. But perhaps you're not at a point where you understand enough about programming and the language to do so, keeping in mind how to best help the person at hand.


this is why you very rarely (if ever) see 'digitalmouse' commenting on a 'code problem' or 'developer how-to' thread! :)