Feb 17 2011, 7:15 pm
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F0lak
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Look, I didn't mean to come off as a 'prick'. I was trying to voice an opinion, it came out wrong, was received badly, and now I'm apologizing. Anyone around BYOND who's spoken with me before this post can attest to me not intending to be as negative as I came off.
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This is very impressive, I can't wait to see what sort of game you produce with it.
My only bit of advice would be to stay away from multiplayer entirely, at least until we have some control over BYOND's netcode or we have client-side processing. Having that many pixel projectiles on-screen while also using what looks like pixel mouse coordinates would cut down your potential player base to about five people with the most beefiest internet connections. I think you should focus solely on single player and make it an incredibly fluid and detailed piece of work. | |
He's actually not using pixel mouse coordinates in the video. That's why I suggested my library, which too, is completely multiplayer friendly.
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I have to agree with F0lak on this one(what he meant, not necessarily what he said). The concept is really awesome and I've been there and done that, but BYOND really just isn't built for it.
At first you might think that it's really innovative. Simple fact is, "pixel movement" is baby stuff to an actual non-BYOND video game programmer. If it's that easy, why hasn't everyone done it on BYOND? It's just because BYOND isn't fast enough. In my opinion, non-BYOND game programmers can probably code 1000x worse and less efficient than the average BYONDer and still have his game(written at C++ or something) run at speeds faster than BYOND can ever reach. It's like you're trying to reinvent the wheel using dried mud rather than wood or stone. I hope you have fun making something really cool with this before you lose motivation, though. :) I'm yea-ing it because I like you :D | |
F0lak wrote:
Don't get me wrong, I love the video. I think it looks great, and am glad that you're showing things that BYOND is capable of doing. But my problem is this: BYOND is designed for tile-based games, MUD's, and Dungeon Crawlers... 1. Games with pixel movement are often tile based. 2. What about board games? Strategy games? Card games? BYOND is not nearly as limiting as you think. That being said, I kind of agree with F0lak. The video isn't impressive and it doesn't do BYOND any good for people to praise insignificant creations. pixel movement isn't a gimmick. super Mario bros. wasn't considered awesome because of its pixel movement, its an awesome game. BYOND needs awesome games, and what you've posted might lead to an awesome game, but until then there just isn't anything worth getting excited about. I believe that BYOND is capable of more than most people think. However, people have a tendency to stop and be satisfied as soon as they've started pushing BYOND's limits (or what people perceive as being limits). What you've shown has been possible for about as long as the pixel_x and pixel_y variables have existed. We didnt need proof it is possible, we need people to follow through and include these things in actual, complete, fun games. | |
"We didn't need proof it is possible, we need people to follow through and include these things in actual, complete, fun games."
The point of this post wasn't to prove it was possible. It's an update on his adventures through vecotrs and angles. These are simply his practical application of the subject. Whiny little maggots, I swear. If you want a good, complete game, stop telling people that what they're working on A) won't amount to anything or B) isn't impressive. If it's not impressive, don't leave a comment, unless it is actually constructive. It may not be a gimmick but I'm sure if Mario could only move between 8x8 tiles, that the game wouldn't have been impressive either. Same goes for Metal Slug; imagine only being able to move in 32 pixel increments in that game. Besides, his agenda may not even be to make a game. As he has stated, he's learning vectors and angles. "Wow, this is like almost a daily update thing! Anyway, another video on more Vector/Angle stuff. I really enjoy these things! :3" That's what a lot of those little projects on BYOND seem to be, little learning experiments. The developers give up when they're satisfied because they've learned what they're there to learn. F0lak, you're an idiot. BYOND needs all of the games it can get, not just a bunch of tile-based games. We can make whatever we want to make. For an example, click on this link. I'm sure BYOND wasn't made for that. | |
Forum_account wrote:
The video isn't impressive and it doesn't do BYOND any good for people to praise insignificant creations. Show me a game on BYOND which does what Oasiscircle did in his videos. Oh right, you can't. Nobody has made a sidescrolling shooter with the same type of aiming mechanic quite as smoothly as Oasis has. I'd have to say this is a pretty significant creation which deserves all the praise and support it can get. | |
SuperAntx wrote:
Show me a game on BYOND which does what Oasiscircle did in his videos. I think SS4Toby had a working top-down shooter that used the same systems. Not sure whatever came of that, but this looks much more fluid and impressive. | |
Top-down is a completely different beast. You're essentially comparing Zelda 1 to Zelda 2.
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That's what a lot of those little projects on BYOND seem to be, little learning experiments. The developers give up when they're satisfied because they've learned what they're there to learn. Oh right, you can't. Nobody has made a sidescrolling shooter with the same type of aiming mechanic quite as smoothly as Oasis has. The video is a proof of concept for a concept that was undoubtedly possible. Isn't there a pixel projectiles library already? I suppose the aiming is novel, but without including the concept in a game, library, tutorial, or demo its early to be giving praises. With the amount of time people spend patting each other on the back its no wonder that games hardly ever get finished. If people are rewarded for creating 1% of a game, why bother with the other 99%? | |
Forum, games are more than just algorithms and artwork. The important thing I see here isn't that Oasis has pixel projectiles or that the weapon is rotating with his cursor, it's the fact it does all those things. It's the fusion of all the different game mechanics which shows promise. Being able to combine these different mechanics into a solid gameplay experience trumps any sort of technical feat any day.
Oasis has created what looks to be a solid foundation to what could be a really fun game, one which hasn't been done on BYOND yet. If you can't appreciate that then frankly I don't even care what your next rebuttal will be. This place doesn't need that sort of negativity. | |
Ahhh.. why did this topic because so filled with hate. ):
I tried to ignore it, but I read every comment and I don't want every one of my "oh hey i did this and its pretty neat" videos to be like this. ): I value both sides of opinions and thanks for giving me so much feedback! :D I hope for more in the future. (: | |
I'm not trying to be negative, but next to people being overly positive its hard for an honest opinion to look reasonable.
If you had just posted text that said: "hey guys, here's a game idea: the player moves left and right on a platform and clicks to shoot at enemies that move straight towards the player. What do you think?" then I don't think you'd have gotten the same response. Features that are new to BYOND or rarely seen on BYOND generate lots of excitement. Hopefully you can turn this into a fun game or useful demo instead of playing down to the simple-minded crowd and just leave it as a tech demo that never turns into anything more. BYOND has enough of those. | |
Forum_account wrote:
Hopefully you can turn this into a fun game or useful demo instead of playing down to the simple-minded crowd and just leave it as a tech demo that never turns into anything more. That. | |