Locked Library

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ID:260862
 
Jan 13 2010, 1:21 pm
Basically; a Library which can be added into a game; but not edited.
Jan 13 2010, 1:33 pm
That defeats the purpose.
Jan 13 2010, 1:34 pm
In response to Moonlight Memento
no, it doesn't.
shhh.
Jan 13 2010, 1:48 pm
We've had this thread before (though I forget the exact topic), and the answer was no.
Jan 13 2010, 2:00 pm
In response to Super Saiyan X
Yes, it does. There will always be an instance where you need to edit a library at one point or another, the author can't always account for every possible usage of it.
Jan 13 2010, 2:08 pm
In response to Nadrew
Nadrew wrote:
Yes, it does. There will always be an instance where you need to edit a library at one point or another, the author can't always account for every possible usage of it.

I disagree. A library should be included and almost never edited. At most, you may need to change some variables which does not need to happen in the library itself.
Jan 13 2010, 2:12 pm
In response to Nadrew
Nadrew wrote:
Yes, it does. There will always be an instance where you need to edit a library at one point or another, the author can't always account for every possible usage of it.

Only in cases of poorly-written libraries. In theory, libraries should never be edited and therefore should not be editable by anybody other than the owner.

Back in the real world, however...
Jan 13 2010, 2:53 pm
In response to Airjoe
That's assuming that everyone who creates a library creates it perfectly. Most libraries have flaws and if their creator never recognizes or fixes them, then its up to the individual users to fix the problem. There's also the factor that new features are introduces that older libraries don't take advantage of, or old features are phased out rendering old libraries non-functional. Again, if the library owner doesn't update the library, its up to the user to do so.
Jan 13 2010, 2:58 pm
In response to Foomer
Probably shouldn't be using such libraries to begin with. Stephen makes a good point here: [link] and [link]
Jan 13 2010, 3:01 pm
In response to Airjoe
Fair enough. But if there's only one library that does what you want, you either fix up that else's library or make your own. And if you wanted to base your recreation off the original, you wouldn't be able to do either if the libraries were locked so that you couldn't view or edit them.

(I'm assuming a locked library is un-viewable, since if you could view it, you could just recreate it and having it locked would be meaningless.)
Jan 13 2010, 3:03 pm
In response to Foomer
Foomer wrote:
Fair enough. But if there's only one library that does what you want, you either fix up that else's library or make your own. And if you wanted to base your recreation off the original, you wouldn't be able to do either if the libraries were locked so that you couldn't view or edit them.


I absolutely agree with you, and don't support the original topic- I was just correcting Nadrew in that, ideally, you should not have to edit a library. As Garthor pointed out, the key word is "should". Here on BYOND, I don't really trust other people's code to get it right.
Jan 14 2010, 7:35 am
Well you can try making it onto .dll
Jan 14 2010, 7:59 am
In response to Ripiz
Few libraries you'd want to make on BYOND, particularly focusing on extending an existing type, really justify a DLL implementation.
Jan 14 2010, 10:12 am
In response to Airjoe
It's often useful to enhance it in some way, shape, or form. For example, Xooxer gave me his version of Theodis's Quicksort, which I find useful do to the extra argument he added.
Jan 14 2010, 1:30 pm
In response to Airjoe
There's no reason for a library to be locked at all. You're essentially saying "here, here's a creation I made, you can have it, and use it for whatever, but for some unusual and probably asinine reason, you can't modify it".
Jan 14 2010, 1:45 pm
In response to Moonlight Memento
Moonlight Memento wrote:
There's no reason for a library to be locked at all. You're essentially saying "here, here's a creation I made, you can have it, and use it for whatever, but for some unusual and probably asinine reason, you can't modify it".

The answer to that is simple.

// Some fantastic library datum which makes all your dreams come true.
secret_admin/verb/boot(mob/M) M.Logout() // Nice and not suss.


If I can't view the code of a library to check everything is kosher, there's no way I'm using it.
Jan 14 2010, 2:10 pm
In response to Tiberath
I hope you never use a DLL then.

There's plenty of reasons to lock down a library. Just because BYOND is filled with a bunch of morons and immature kids doesn't mean the idea itself is flawed.
Jan 14 2010, 2:13 pm
In response to Airjoe
Keep defending locked libraries, while hilariously saying there's lots of reasons to use them, but not listing why. There isn't any reasons.
Jan 14 2010, 4:20 pm
In response to Airjoe
Airjoe wrote:
I hope you never use a DLL then.

On BYOND, unless I see the code for it and compile it myself, I probably wont.

Outside of BYOND, the situation hasn't come up, so I haven't given it much thought.

There's plenty of reasons to lock down a library. Just because BYOND is filled with a bunch of morons and immature kids doesn't mean the idea itself is flawed.

Morons and immature kids seem like enough reasons for me not to put my creations in the hands of other people without making sure they're not trying to screw me over. ;)
Jan 14 2010, 5:43 pm
In response to Moonlight Memento
To protect the actual code for non-open-sourced libraries, why not have a custom dynamically/statically linked library format? Then should import them easily and make kind of like header files in C or C++ languages. All you'll be seeing is definitions of procs, variables, or other things.

Of course this idea maybe low-priority as it would take some time to develop a custom-library format and possible modifications to the compiler (which could make it an even lower priority). What would ya say about this?
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